Cuprajake I would be the same, if I could buy from somewhere like BB I would probably already have one.
Decent Experience and Poll
Cuprajake obviously not a decent owner but i heard a different story, it is capable of making great microfoam. Comparable to GS3 which is said to be barista dream.
Of course not first hand experience but I would say if the older versions were weak on steaming power they would have fixed it by now. They keep evolving, quickly. I have to give them that
Maybe the newer ones do, I’ve not really looked too in-depth with them for a while.
I know there are a few cheaper used machines on decents site
Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -
I’ve been PM chatting with a fellow named Windsleigher on Basecamp, who says:
Julian I own and have used both Sheldon’s Spacer Kit spacer and Sheldon’s Diffuser. The Diffuser left me with pucks that were not as dry, and worse, there was hot water retention left above the shower screen especially after flushes. When I wiped the screen after a flush, it would release the surface tension and the hot water would drop onto my hand,burning it. That was why I went back to the Spacer Kit Spacer. Driest pucks and virtually no hot water retention.
This experience was with the original brass group head parts. I found that the spacer was not a perfect fit when I installed the v2 PPS parts, so IMO it was not able to be used. After two months using the v2 PPS parts, I reinstalled the original brass and Sheldon’s Spacer Kit Spacer and regained the driest pucks and best taste, without having to increase the dose weight. The parameters of the profile were followed more consistently and more accurately.
Does the above make any sense to you?
Presume he’s talking about headspace
I know the new version of the decent has been designed to give an e61 equivalent group space, perhaps that
Don’t forget though once you start long fine grind profile shots the pucks will be soggy messes, a puck screen will help
Jumping to the super flow baskets makes for dryer pucks but there a ball ache to remove,
Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -
Hiya JHC, Jake is right, Windslayer is talking about headspace. He is saying that he prefers the coffee the DE1 produces with a little less headspace than the DE1 gives with the current group head parts, and so has added Sheldon’s spacer in order to reduce the headspace further.
The DE1 has always prioritised clarity of flavour over body, and so has historically had a larger headspace than a ‘typical’ E61 machine. John has stated in the past this is because it is much easier to reduce headspace than add it, for example by adding a puck screen, or updosing. What Windslayer also mentions is that he is able to get dry pucks and the flavour he enjoys by using Sheldon’s spacer without having to increase the dose. I’m inferring from this that he can get an equivalent rate in the cup by updosing, but has gone for the spacer for convenience. He states that he uses the brass parts as he is a unable to get a good seal between Sheldon’s spacer and the new PPS grouphead, otherwise I would imagine he would be using the new grouphead parts.
An easy way to experiment with reduced headspace is to simply increase the dose from 18g to say 20g in the stock 18g basket. Alternatively you can stick with your current dose and go down a basket size to 15g. You could add a puck screen instead if you like. Have a play and see what works for you. It’s very dependent on the type of coffee you enjoy. One of the things I like about the Decent is you can tweak and optimise it for whatever type of roast level you feel like using at the time.
Give me a shout if you get stuck!
Decent DE1 • Mazzer Philos
I watch most vids at 1.5 times speed,
Had some interesting points about back to back stability
Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -
- Edited
JHCCoffee funnily enough I had the opposite results using SworksDesign head space kit and diffuser. Drier pucks.
But Decent recently came out with their updated version and I upgraded to that. Can’t say they it is better than SworksDesign but it’s an improvement for sure over the previous Decent version.
I’ve seen the test logs on the newer Decent version and from memory the test ran over 500 times and several years so I decided not to try and second guess their efforts.
PS full respect for windsleighers opinions, he is an astute contributor. It’s just that in this case my experience was different, perhaps due to other variables.
- Edited
tompoland funnily enough I had the opposite results using SworksDesign head space kit and diffuser. Drier pucks.
Thanks Tom. So I’m confused. The machine that is about to arrive at my home is a v1.42 with the Sworks Diffuser (but not a Sworks Headspace Kit); the Diffuser apparently has some extent of headspace reduction built in. Is that sufficient?
I just want sufficiently dry pucks with no channeling and even distribution. I was able to get that with my Lelit E, through WDT, a puck screen, the right size basement and dose, and program adjustments. I do not wish to go backwards, or have or create undue challenges in learning how to use the machine.
Do I have what I need? If not what should I get?
My gut feel is that what I have (the v1 grouphead and the Sworks diffuser) will do the job, and that I do not need to spend further $$$ on the Decent Grouphead upgrade kit or additional SworksDesign accessories. Am I missing something here? I’d buy one or both of these items if there is a true significant benefit.
Frankly I’d rather save for a Niche Duo or a Kaffelogic Roaster. But if there is a strong reason to buy these Decent parts, I will. LMK.
For what it’s worth, Decent would be the least “shady” of any business I’ve dealt with. I literally can not think of a person or a business that’s been more open and transparent in my 40+ years in business.
John Buckman is on at least 4 publicly accessible forums that I know of, taking questions and answering them in an open and transparent manner. Rather than harbouring and posting about shady business practices, anyone can go ask him directly. He will offer you a rational and well thought out explanation of exactly why they do things they way they do.
In terms of steaming, the XXL model is apparently the bees knees. The others are generally regarded as ok but not stellar.
most forums is copy and paste, perhaps i dont see the interactions as much. wasnt a dig, just dont like that you have to be part of the club to join a place, esp when posts like this come up with the op asking questions, that if it were any other machine there would be a wealth of knowledge avilable,
Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -
- Edited
Re Decent’s supposed predatory pricing. It’s more complicated than we think.
I note that many Brits like to travel to or own property in the Caymans, which has no income taxes. And both the Caymans and Ireland are notorious corporate tax havens. And that many Brits, especially those who can afford to buy expensive espresso machines, use every income tax loophole they can find. Two supposed wrongs don’t make a right. But Decent’s VAT pricing is a drop in the bucket.
And..What about the pricing of the item itself? If a machine is competively priced or put in sale, is that predatory? If Niche put their machines on sale, or charged reduced VAT, would anyone here complain?
And what about espresso products that are made using non-union labour? Or low-wage labour? Is that predatory? Where is your favourite Niche or other machine built? (China). Btw, I’m actually a supporter of paying fair wages.
What if a manufacturer reduces manufacturing costs and is able to pass that savings through to the consumer? Is that predatory?
Just saying that the topic is much more complex than it seems.
people dont half get their knickers in a twist, i for one dont care what decent do, im about £2000 away from buying a decent,
every thread has to decend into he said she said,
i wish i could afford a cayman island then i could fuck off over there and never have to deal with people again,
Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -
- Edited
JHCCoffee And that many Brits, especially those who can afford to buy expensive espresso machines, use every income tax loophole they can find.
With all due respect… what an insulting statement…. Wow. Just wow.
Cuprajake most forums is copy and paste
Not my point.
He’s on multiple forums multiple times every week and makes himself available and answers questions clearly when put to him. That’s my point.
Before anyone posts about shady practices, give him the opportunity to answer those concerns. Isn’t that what we would all want if we were him? The opportunity to answer a question rather than having suspicions about our integrity posted publicly?
In terms of knowledge about the Decent, there’s 208 pages of knowledge about the Decent on CoffeeSnobs alone, not to mention HB, Discord (massive) and YouTube (ditto).
Seriously, if some one wants to know something about the Decent, go to one of the forums or platforms mentioned above or simply just ask John directly.
The whole notion of information about the Decent being kept behind closed doors is simply not true. There are giant bucket loads of information available about the Decent.
People point to Diaspora as being a closed community, and it is. But as mentioned above there are at least four forums featuring open and active threads for Decent owners and non owners. How many open forums on the Decent do people need? Hardly a secret society.
Definitely not a dig at you Jake, but there are others that slag John and Decent from a vacuum of ignorance or perpetuate mistruths without even scratching beneath the surface of those mistruths.
Taxation aside, they have some excellent videos on youtube under the dial in decently series. It would be good to see similar from other manufacturers/vendors.
- Edited
MediumRoastSteam With all due respect… what an insulting statement…. Wow. Just wow.
No insult meant. Canadians and Americans do the same. It’s just that you can’t complain about VAT avoidance and then also limit your income tax exposure in the same breath.
I’m not saying people of your or my means don’t pay our fair share of taxes. But we do have accountants that know how to limit tax exposure.