I can’t seem to get rid of unpleasant harshness and dryness

MMuddyOne · 7 Jan

This is the answer I got from them

“The coffee boiler temp will heat up the longer the machine is on, so perhaps best to put the machine in eco mode when not needing it to make coffee, or when not used for longer periods.”

I replied that if machine is not keeping stable temperature that was set then that’s not how pid should work and is certainly malfunctioning.

But setting the offset to minus four helped keep 95 degrees ,I need to wait till tomorrow for machine to cool down now to see if that is the case both after 30 minutes and 1h

Cuprajake · 7 Jan

Having a dual boiler that doesn’t keep stable temp is pointless, may as well have bought an hx and saved the money.

Bit of a crap answer.

How long does the machine take to heat up.

MMuddyOne · 7 Jan

Cuprajake i test after 30 minutes and then it shows temperature that was set , after another 30 minutes it charges up again.

I suspect that it’s fully charged after 20-25 minutes already.

Adrianmsmith · 7 Jan

Cuprajake

@MuddyOne

Agree with Jake. Bad answer from your dealer.

I had a synchronika which isnt that different control wise to what you have and never had any temperature issues

Does the reported temperature change or just the actual.

MMuddyOne · 7 Jan

Adrianmsmith

Sorry I’m not sure about your question:)

If you set the temperature to x, after 30 minutes it will be x and obviously that’s the time it should take machine to fully charge up already . But after a while it will raise by another 2-4 degrees, can’t say after how much exactly as I test in 30 minutes gaps after turning it on, it may 40, 50 minutes after turning on. No wonder I’ve been experiencing bitter espresso if I was brewing dark roast at 93 degrees thinking it’s 88-89 or medium at 97-99 .

MediumRoastSteam · 7 Jan

MuddyOne The coffee boiler temp will heat up the longer the machine is on, so perhaps best to put the machine in eco mode when not needing it to make coffee, or when not used for longer periods.”

As predicted.

MediumRoastSteam “Oh, that’s just perfectly normal. I wouldn’t worry about that. Those machines need a cooling flush after being idle for longer than 30 minutes”. No, no, no. It’s a dual boiler. It should not behave like that.

Total nonsense. As Jake said… It’s a dual boiler. One boiler is for brew water (i.e.: Should be kept at brewing temperature at all times) - the other other boiler is for steaming. There’s no reason for the brew boiler to overheat over time - That ’s for a Heat Exchanger machine behaviour.

They are fobbing you off.

Total nonsense.

Adrianmsmith · 7 Jan

MuddyOne

Does the pid still show the set temperature or does that change as well.

Or

Is it just that actual water that is hotter then what the machine says it is

Ie is it something along the lines of faulty relay or faulty control logic

MMuddyOne · 7 Jan

Adrianmsmith well I will run more tests in following days now that I have this device but, last test it went up to 95 degrees with off set now -4 , but after 10-15 s dropped to 90 I wanted to actually ask if that how it should look like, I understand that flushing drops temp , but that also means that after few seconds we are not brewing at regular temperature.

I will run more tests tomorrow.

Adrianmsmith · 7 Jan

MuddyOne

The offset is not time dependant.

Its just a “fudge” because the temperature probe is not at the point where you want the set temp to be correct.

It should not be used to vary the temperature over time as you require

To find out what is happening we need more info.

I.e is the heater relay doing as it is told by a faulty control circuit or logic or is it closing when it should not and heating when it should not.

Need to check the pid temp, the set point as well as the actual water temp at the time periods you have issues with .

Now you have elaborated what’s happening, offset is not your issue

MMuddyOne · 7 Jan

Adrianmsmith yeah I think something is wrong with the machine and it’s not offset , look I set off set to minus 3 and turned on machine (it started heating up from 25 degrees since last time I turned it on) after 25 minutes it reached only 84 degrees, then pid showed it dropped to 79 degrees in 30 seconds.

Second video I tested after 1h of turning it on, it reached 93-94 degrees but not 95 , something is wrong with the pid here:(

MediumRoastSteam · 24 Jan

Any updates?

MMuddyOne · 24 Jan

MediumRoastSteam

Yeah, I was going to make a summary of updates once the machine gets back to me.

Seller accepted that something is wrong, got my machine posted two weeks ago, they are sending me updates, one that temperature was unstable and they narrowed down the issue to ntc probe and fitted a new one, then they wanted to keep machine for couple more days for testing. I also asked to check the pressure as something didn’t seem to be right there too.

Couple days ago I got another update saying that they are back and forth with profitec but they are slow to reply and on top of that their thermocouple has broken and they are now waiting for a replacement. That’s all for now, they did not give me the reason of communicating back and forth with profitec though.

MMuddyOne · 2 Feb

MediumRoastSteam

My machine should come next week, they just sent me an email saying that after thorough testing they are now happy with stable temperature, espresso been delicious and consistent, they’ve been replicating shots. Also the pressure is stable. My machine should arrive soon, once we both agree on date of delivery . I’ll run some tests and see how things taste, hopefully no more harshness

Adrianmsmith · 2 Feb

MuddyOne

It would be good to see a list of what they have done and replaced ……

MMuddyOne · 2 Feb

Adrianmsmith they only have told me that ntc probe was replaced and temperature been stable when left for long periods of time, also off set been set to minus 2 as the temperature been showing 4 degrees higher of what been set.

I just sent them an email to confirm if that’s all the work that has been done 👍

Aacopl · 6 Feb

Hey, I’ve experienced a similar issue as yours; I can’t seem to get a good espresso from this machine. My current setting is 90°C with an offset of -2°C.

Do you have any updates on whether the machine has been fixed?

Adrianmsmith · 6 Feb

acopl

Have you tested your actual water temperature to see if that actually is your issue.

MMuddyOne · 6 Feb

acopl the machine should be with me tomorrow, you need to test if temperature is stable. Perhaps your boiler probe is bad too

Aacopl · 10 Feb

Hey, after conducting a few tests, I found that setting the temperature offset to -1c/-2c gave me the correct brew head temperature.

However, even at 93°C, I couldn’t get a tasty espresso. I’ve since dropped it to 86°C, and it’s much better now.

How about you? What’s your brew head temperature?

MediumRoastSteam · 10 Feb

acopl - Your machine must have a problem then. It’s just not normal to have espresso extracted with the brew head temperature being at 86C.

Adrianmsmith · 10 Feb

MediumRoastSteam

is he saying that is what the temperature is set at or is that the actual water temperature.

If it is the water temperature, maybe it is the taster 🤭🤔

Aacopl · 10 Feb

Hi guys, sorry for any confusion. I’m referring to the water temperature set on the machine, which seems quite accurate in matching the brew head water temperature as well.

I’ve adjusted the setting with an offset to -1/-2.

Adrianmsmith · 10 Feb

acopl

How are you checking the actual water temperature 🌡️?

MediumRoastSteam · 10 Feb

@Adrianmsmith - Regardless… 86C on the display is not something normally seen on this sort of machine, unless you favour very under-extracted and sour espresso.

Or the machine is overheating and giving false readings… Or something else is off.

Adrianmsmith · 10 Feb

MediumRoastSteam

Exactly, but, what im asking is

Does it say 86 on the display

What is the actual water temp.

If that is 86 then the only issue is the beans!

Aacopl · 10 Feb

Hi, I’m using a K-type thermocouple and placing the sensor inside the portafilter basket without any coffee grounds.

For espresso, I’m using medium-dark roasted beans.

Grinder: Niche Zero, 17 to 35 grams in 30 seconds.

Flow control to 8 ml/s.

Adrianmsmith · 16 Feb

This video should help with your technique.

Ive been referring to it for nine years to help perfect, everything ☕🤣

Happy sunday

…… I wonder who will be the first “with milk drinks it makes no difference”…. 😋

RRaja123 · 16 Feb

Gail is ace.

Regarding milk, my own experience is that I can still taste origin/the more potent flavor notes through it. On the flip side, it can also mask some of the unpleasant attributes of a shot. Maybe people abuse that second point, just to……put milk+coffee drinkers down, heh.

JJason1wood · 16 Feb

I always taste my espresso before adding to milk, even if it tastes rank, the steamed milk makes it taste delicious 🤣

MMuddyOne · 26 Feb

Ok so I finally received my machine couple weeks ago, with all the mess with their broken device,Christmas period and all they had it for about a month.

Probe been changed and off set adjusted to -2. I have been testing temperature at couple different occasions.

I’m getting accurate temperature now but will keep an eye on how it behaves , they also said the pressure was fine.

I still can’t get 1:2 in 30s , 27 s is closest and then machine starts “ choking “ and extraction starts late.

I forgot to mention earlier that I have replaced screen to ims competition, if that makes much difference, I’m using darkwoods barrel aged coffee.