[T](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/account/ "Account details") * [Home](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/) * [Forums](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/forums/) * [Coffee Forums](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/forums/#coffee-forums.3) * **[Technical | Faults | How-to's](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/forums/technical-faults-how-tos.20/)** # Elektra T1 Heat exchanger Espresso Machine Cool espresso [Tags](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/threads/elektra-t1-heat-exchanger-espresso-machine-cool-espresso.65862/tags)[crema](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/tags/crema/) [elektra](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/tags/elektra/) [heat exchanger](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/tags/heat-exchanger/) **[Jump to Latest](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/threads/elektra-t1-heat-exchanger-espresso-machine-cool-espresso.65862/post-878192)[Unfollow](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/threads/elektra-t1-heat-exchanger-espresso-machine-cool-espresso.65862/watch)** **1 - 4 of 4 Posts** [T](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/members/twotone.8889/) #### **[twotone](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/members/twotone.8889/)** ##### **Registered** Joined Jan 13, 2015 509 Posts **Discussion Starter** · [#1 ](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/threads/elektra-t1-heat-exchanger-espresso-machine-cool-espresso.65862/post-878167)· [Apr 14, 2022 (Edited)](https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/threads/elektra-t1-heat-exchanger-espresso-machine-cool-espresso.65862/post-878167) Hi, just wondering if anyone can offer some advice. I have a 2007 Elektra T1 Deliziosa and I'm really struggle to get decent espresso. I buy beans fresh, on subscription, from Coffee Compass, and no matter the beans I rarely get crema however I know that the lack of crema is not an indication of the beans not being fresh and the size of the cup can make the crema almost non-existent but I'm not getting any crema regardless of the beans and regardless of where I buy them from, in the recent past I've bought from Rave and Redber and a few other roasters who advertise on here. I have a La Cimbali commercial grinder with, I think, 73mm burrs and it grinds perfectly okay. I grind 14g and pull 28/30g of espresso in around 35 seconds and I have also adjusted the grind to go long and short but no difference. I mainly drink milk based coffees so as a result I didn't really notice this issue too much but I've been tasting the espresso recently and to my mind it's not very hot and I'm wondering if this is the reason that I'm not really getting decent crema? The machine seems to be functioning properly, the hot water dispenses at around 95degrees C in a cup and there's plenty of steam but the coffee in the cup is only around 70 degrees C and it comes out the brew head at about 77 degrees C. I regularly clean the shower screen or replace it and I clean the brass shower screen holder (for wants of a better description) and I clean out the eight or so holes in that I do this at least once a month or sooner. I also flush the machine before making an espresso to cool down the heat exchanger so that the coffee doesn't burn but and the machine is on for sometimes an hour before making a coffee and sometimes it's about ten/15 minutes. Thanks for any replies. Tony I started a thread on the old forum here guys might save me re-posting photos etc. https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/threads/elektra-t1-heat-exchanger-espresso-machine-cool-espresso.65862/#post-878175

A bit of an update. I removed and cleaned shower screen and brass dispersion thing with the ten holes and gave both a good clean I also removed the top nut on the group head to clean out anything in there, the nut has a spring and a shaft type thing that fits over a bolt which I think is the solenoid below the group head so I'm presuming when you push the button for a shot of coffee then the solenoid pushes the spring up to allow water go through the group head but either I've not re-installed the assembly properly or I've managed to block something up either way I'm not getting water out of the group head now😞

It sounds like the machine is scaled up, what sort of water are you using? from the pressure guage the pressure looks normal at around 1.2 to 1.3 bar. This sort of machine needs at least 30m to warm the group/p[ortafilter up before it's ready to make coffee. > @"Twotone2"#p15383 the nut has a spring and a shaft type thing that fits over a bolt which I think is the solenoid below the group head so I’m presuming when you push the button for a shot of coffee then the solenoid pushes the spring up to allow water go through the group head but either I’ve not re-installed the assembly properly or I’ve managed to block something up Do you have a photo/s of this part

Hi @"DavecUK"#p15408 Thanks the part is no 6 in the PDF drawing below it's an injector much like a pilot injector on a boiler. I sorted the machine by cleaning out the hole in the injector which is tiny 0.9mm I think, the temperature differential is now about 1°C. I might dial back the pressure stat to what it was before I adjusted it yesterday, the steam and hot water temperature are a good bit hotter than before, might be a good thing though? I replied in a bit more depth to a poster in the old forum who has been suggesting a few things. Here's the link including photos which I updated earlier on this morning. Thanks again. Tony https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/threads/elektra-t1-heat-exchanger-espresso-machine-cool-espresso.65862/#post-878233 https://www.home-barista.com/downloads/Elektra_Sixties_1gr_Parts.pdf

Hi @"Twotone2"#p15479 Tony I have this machine. Its almost certainly scale in the HX, when mine starts to run cool brew temps that's always what it is. I have a very fine thermocouple jammed in the group bell so keep a close eye on it. 2 options - crack the top cap on the head as you have and remove spring arrangement/gliceur jet etc and descale in separate bowl. You also then need to remove the front cover above the drip tray and undo the left hand pipe to drain the HX from its lowest point (messy, have shallow tray to catch water - remember to turn water off before you start all this if plumbed in 😀 ). Put pipe back on, then refill HX from top group cap with descale solution, I use food grade citric at 30g/L. Leave an hour, drain out via bottom pipe again, and repeat. Option 2, open HX from on top of boiler. Often requires gorilla socket skills and a new gasket so maybe try other way first. Hope that helps - shout if you need pics/more help Matt

Hi guys, I'm still struggling with this machine, the espresso is a bit shit to be honest and I'm at a bit of a loss now I've ordered a naked PF with a 21g basket which should arrive tomorrow cause I think I might be having issues with channeling but despite buying fresh coffee beans from various different places I don't get any crema, ever and the coffee isn't great as I said in my OP because I drink mainly milk based drinks I don't really notice it much but in an Americano or an espresso the coffee would be sent back if I was buying it in a cafe. Basically I'm not managing to pull decent shots within a 25/30 second pull despite the grind then I either get long times ie around 60 seconds from when the coffee comes out of the spout until I get about 28 g in the cup (I'm using the stock 14 g double basket) so if I go coarse the coffee stream starts blonding almost immediately and if I go fine it takes ages and drip drip drips out of the spout no steady stream, no honey like constancy just basically poor coffee. Last week I replaced the solenoid valve (part number 18) after having a word with the guys at espresso services in Govan they also gave me some Jaguar phosphoric acid descaler which I used to descale the top part of the group head by removing the hex nut (part no 1) and pouring some descaler in and leaving it for about an hour then flushing. The problems have gotten less with the new solenoid valve (a bit of an improvement) but it's still not right the guys at ES thought that the issues might be 1) SV 2) pump head 3) scaled up HEX but I checked the pump with a blank disc in the PF and I'm getting 8/9 bar on the left hand gauge but I know that the gauge could be faulty but it does seem to be working fine ie 2.5 bar without the pump engaged and 9 bar with it engaged. The boiler pressure up to temp reads about 1.3bar as I previously adjusted the pressure stat which did make the coffee in the cup hotter and I videoed & timed the water coming through the group head at about 60 seconds/90g and temp of the water from the group head is around 94/5 degrees C. So obviously I'm going to take the machine into ES for a proper service and have them look at it properly as there's only so much advice they can offer from my descriptions of what's going on but I want to try to eliminate a few things first or at least be able to provide more information so I've gone back to basics ie fresh beans freshly ground, tamping, distribution and hot cup and flushing the machine which is why I've ordered the naked PF but I don't think it's operator error it may be that I'm not flushing the machine properly but I've started flushing it for around 25 seconds before a shot and again no difference to the coffee from before when I was maybe only flushing it for about five or six seconds. The only other variable is the grinder which is a La Cimbali Magnum grinder with 73 mm burrs which I bought second hand from a member on here about four years ago the burrs were brand new as I recall when I got the machine and I grind about a half a kg of beans a week but I've no idea if the grinder is faulty certainly the grinds look okay to me but who knows and I don't have another grinder to try however my son has a cheap Delonghi KG89 grinder that we bought him for Christmas so I could probably try that in order to rule out the grinder. Apologies for the length of this post but any advice & suggestions etc would be appreciated. Thanks Tony

@"Twotone2"#p19093 Does sound like the grinder could be the problem assuming you must have tried coffee from various reputable online sources.

Thanks @"DavecUK"#1, I've been looking at when I bought the grinder it was about around Feb 2016 so I've had it for six years now. I was thinking about just buying a grinder online or maybe asking the guys at ES for a loan of one to rule the grinder out. Tony Found the for sale thread. https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/threads/sold-la-cimbali-magnum-£200.27266/#post-380772

@"Twotone2"#p19102 Did the problem start suddenly?

@"DavecUK"#p19105 No it's been ongoing for a good 18 months I'd say I was buying beans on-line from one of the roasters on here during the first lock-down and I was struggling to get decent espresso so just put it down to the beans at the time, the guy send me fresh beans and it was still the same so I bought from other places and really no difference then I started looking at the Elektra as the culprit but I'm thinking that I've not change how I do things I think the Elektra is working okay now so the only other thing is the grinder.

@"Twotone2"#p19111 When did you last check the burrs and that the screws were tight?

Elektra T1 Heat exchanger Espresso Machine Cool espresso

CoyoteOldMan

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Twotone2

Pretty much like I feel right now😳

I’m getting some channelling now but that’s a whole other story and the grind is way off but at least the machine is working properly.

Thanks to everyone for their input and advice guys, much appreciated.

Tony

dutchy101

Always great to see someone bring their kit back to life. Good work all!

Twotone2

Hi guys, the machine is clearly back to it’s best, probably the best since I’ve had it the coffee is now amazing, I actually can hardly believe the difference.

I’m getting channeling with some shots and there is a definite chemical smell from the hot water tap/steam tap but that’s receding with every flush of the hot tap.

I used the naked PF for an espresso this morning and, despite the obvious channeling, that’s probably the best espresso I’ve had in the house for a good 18 months or so, I’ve spent a fortune on beans in all of that time and clearly not tasted those beans properly although there have been times when the coffee was decent but it’s amazing how milk can mask poor coffee extraction.

Tony

PS, for anyone interested I bought the bottomless PF complete with 21mm basket on ebay for £25 delivered for comparison the Elektra PF’s are about £95 online and in some case as much as £130 they are a lot heavier though.

Twotone2

dutchy101

Great stuff!

Twotone2

BTW guys, my grinder is a bit of a clump monster, always has been, just wondering if anyone can recommend something better or something to stop or minimise the clumping?

Don’t get me wrong its a very good grinder with 73mm burrs but at fine grinding the clumps are huge however I break them up with the plastic spoon then use a toothpick when the coffee is in the basket.

CoyoteOldMan

Twotone2 my grinder is a bit of a clump monster

Have you tried the “Ross Droplet Technique” aka a little spray of water on the beans just before grinding? Only suitable for single-dosing, but it seems to work well on my Ceado.

If it is mechanically possible, I would consider eliminating the doser/distributor

DavecUK

I bought one of these…doesn’t help me with my non clumpy grinder, but would probably help with a clump monsta.

The one I purchased was 8.99, but there are none at that price left…the link above is the same item though…nice black anodised aluminium handle. With the discount it ends up at £10.30

Twotone2

DavecUK The one I purchased was 8.99, but there are non at that price left…the link above is the same item though…nice black anodised aluminium handle. With the discount it ends up at £10.30

Thanks, can’t really go wrong with that so I’ve ordered one👍

Twotone2

CoyoteOldMan Have you tried the “Ross Droplet Technique” aka a little spray of water on the beans just before grinding? Only suitable for single-dosing, but it seems to work well on my Ceado.

If it is mechanically possible, I would consider eliminating the doser/distributor

Not tried that I’ll have a look, thanks.

I bought the machine with a doser mod (funnel thing and bellows sort of effort) but I ended up putting it back to stock, think I’ve still got that somewhere but I remember it was a bit of a faff having to load the exact amount of beans then having to be careful that they didn’t shoot out of the grinder.

CoyoteOldMan

Twotone2 Nothing shoots out from under this:

(Jokes aside - a cheap tamper provides a nice anti-popcorn device once you remove the hopper)

John_Yossarian

It looks great! I might be wrong but the ground seems a tad too fine. I guess if you pulled back one or two notches on the grinder you will get excellent flow. Or it might be the amount you put in the basket.

Twotone2

John_Yossarian It looks great! I might be wrong but the ground seems a tad too fine. I guess if you pulled back one or two notches on the grinder you will get excellent flow. Or it might be the amount you put in the basket.

Thanks John, yes you were correct, I’ve now adjusted the grind, weirdly, right back up to number seven and the coffee is amazing actually.

I’m into my second KG bag of Coffee Compass mystery beans no 14 can highly recommend them now that I can taste them, LOL.

I must have wasted about 80% of the last bag sadly.

Also the naked PF is excellent too, a wee bit light compared to the Elektra PFs but I like it I’m looking forward to getting the distribution tool later on today cause I’m still pulling channeled shots with holes in the puck but the coffee is still great though.

Tony

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