ACS Vesuvius Evo Leva

danielpugh

Quick update - have sourced an RO machine, and in process getting a drain installed. So this morning I thought I’d take a look at the leak. surprisingly It’s gone. Turns out if you have a leak on a machine at 125deg then the water coming out bubbles and looks like in that photo (I.e. cotton wool). However the joints need fixing as the pipe going into the boiler rotates with finger pressure. Unlike the check valve that needs to be undone first which is both super tight and difficult to get to.

[Edit] easier to take the whole boiler out - took about 15 mins after hrs if trying to get a decent angle

DavecUK

danielpugh leak. surprisingly It’s gone. Turns out if you have a leak on a machine at 125deg then the water coming out bubbles and looks like in that photo (I.e. cotton wool). However the joints need fixing as the pipe going into the boiler rotates with finger pressure. Unlike the check valve that needs to be undone first which is both super tight and difficult to get to.

[Edit] easier to take the whole boiler out - took about 15 mins after hrs if trying to get a decent angle

I definitely thought it would be easier to remove the boiler………People always worry, but it’s very few connectors to remove, heating element wires some easy to remove PTFE connections and compressions connectors… The fitting above those elbows can be a pig to get to. For the factory it’s fine because of course they are building them and sealing as they go. I have even seen on some machines with a rotary pump the need to remove the boilers to replace an antibackflow valve….because it was assembled with a pipe structure in place and then the boiler installed with it all connected. of course, nothing could be undone without boiler removal.

Glad it’s sorted, presumably you used PTFE to reseal?

SimonBarker

danielpugh Which RO machine did you go for?

I’m curious because I’m moving my machine which means it’ll no longer be plumbed in, I think I’ve narrowed the choices down to either a tankless RO setup or mixing bottled water.

danielpugh

So looking inside the boiler with a camera flash lighting up through hole in the bottom - boiler internals are pristine, so no limescale to worry about at this point (good news).

Ascertained the main cause I think. The threading of the pipe out of the bottom of the boiler is only tight when about 30 degrees further turned than the two on the top I.e. turned to the side of the machine rather than the front as the pipes need. So for the pipes to fit the pipe has to be loosened - hence the leak.

Question at this point is - do I use PTFE tape to fill the gap or PTFE liquid, or both or a.n.other?

DavecUK

danielpugh Question at this point is - do I use PTFE tape to fill the gap or PTFE liquid, or both or a.n.other?

Personally, I would go for tape..

Lube thread with Molykote, wrap PTFE (not sure how many turns 6 or 7??). Ensure PTFE is wrapped the right way around the thread, smear Molykote thinly over PTFE. The elbow should be tight all the way in…so you can just about turn it, without the remotest risk of bending or snapping it.

before doing all this, eyeball how far fully in is, as only thread to thread engagement seals, I think the end plates of the boilers are 8mm thick. Also you want to make sure you turn it to the right position and never have to go backwards if possible.

rusty-pie

I was wondering if someone could post a photo am memory metal and traditional vacuum breaker

DavecUK

This is the one in the prototype, different to production ones…to change it I would have to remove the boiler, because the nut can’t be turned! The T piece with sealant thus needs to be removed, but that can’t be done because it can’t be rotated unless the boiler is removed (which ain’t so easy on the prototype).

I call it fitted by a someone who needs a kick as they only needed to have that T piece 5mm higher.

danielpugh

@SimonBarker - the waterdrop G2 with a separate mineral additive. I’d be careful generally as from their faq it has slowish rates so not suitable for some purposes - I am taking a bit of a gamble because it’s cheap ;-). My Plan is to ignore the tap and plumb straight to machine. For my Evo I know this is fine as I can use the on-board tank as a buffer and just raise the fill sensor so it fills the reservoir a bit higher giving longer to fill. However I can imagine it might cause problems for direct fill machines where strange things happen when if there is low pressure.

Annoyingly they do a higher flow rate version in America, but not available in Europe yet (current G2 is 400 GPM i.e. 1.2 litres per minute new version in USA is 600 GPM e. 1.8 litres per minute).

danielpugh

@DavecUK - thanks - it’s all back together and hiss has gone, so tentatively all good!
From taking it apart, some notes in case useful to anyone in the future.

The temp sensor has a connector half way down the back of the wiring loom. While reconnecting when putting boiler back in, This came out. The connector is cable tied behind both the weight and the back panel. So you have to remove both to change the sensor as well as cut multiple cable ties. Given I have had these fail before I moved this cable and connector to make it separate, so now the sensor can be changed easily.
The same wiring is squashed between the weight at the back of the caseand the boiler insulation - also in my case against the opening mechanism of the side door. This was rubbing and causing wear on the cable sheaf. It would probably take a long time to wear through, but again a reason to change the cable routing slightly. I moved the remaining cables so separate from the opening mechanism/guide.
Also the guide/mechanism for the side door wasn’t quite held together by the thumbscrew and nylon nut - the thumbscre was coming out of the travel/guide mechanism as slightly too small. so i added some of the nylon washers. Now itholds the mechanism together a bit more cleanly (the same ones recommended for holding the 4 group screws).

LMSC

danielpugh Glad you have fixed the issue. Touch wood. 👌

When you have time, if you don’t mind, could you post some pictures of those 3 points you addressed? It will be of great help for others like myself.

What RO unit did you buy ? Please post a detailed review of this when it is up and running.

Thx

danielpugh

@LMSC - here you go hopefully makes sense on this -
This is the rear of the machine with weight and rear side removed). The red cable on the left is the PID sensor (previously cable tied on the right. The side opening mechanism is on the right side. You should be able to see the bunch of cables it was rubbing against - again on the right side.

[Edit] worth noting that it was very easy to remove the boiler. First I removed the plate from the bottom (Allen keys). Remember to take out the water reservoir before lifting machine or all will get wet! The boiler has three pipes coming off it. Two go to steam and water arms and were easy to remove with spanners. I then undid the other end of the third pipe at the far end i.e. I unscrewed at the manifold end leaving a long pipe down to the underneath still connected (so water would not escape). This pipe is the one that connects to the boiler underside.
I then took photos of top and bottom, removed cables and three mounting screws that hold the boiler in and lifted the whole lot out. I didn’t need to drain the boiler at all using this method. Once out i emptied it into the sink and took the underneath pipe off (as it was the one leaking), and the PID sensor. This meant I could shine a phone/light through the hole in the bottom while looking through the top and Thus see the element etc.

LMSC

danielpugh Extremely valuable. Thank you so much!

DavecUK

All valuable reference information. Now you have delved to nside it, any opinions on build quality and ease of maintenance?

LMSC

Evo steam boiler flush and light descale!

Until now, I thought I have been doing a full flush of the service boiler every month. We now know, the same Minima boiler on the Evo is set up differently. So, I have been flushing out only about of half of the 1.61L fill on the service boiler.

I want to manually drain out the service boiler some time this month. I am going to grab a 500ml syringe. I have not done this before. I may require a lot of help.

I am thinking if removing the temp sensor is easier.
Could some one help me with detailed directions to remove the connections to drain the service boiler please ?
What tools I need ?
How do I remove the wire? Should I unscrew the bolt and hopefully, the wire come off ?
Is the copper nut turned clock wise or anti to loosen?

Perhaps, I will also do a slight descale with perhaps 50g of citic acid as it will be 6 months since the Evo got delivered. What’s the best way to inject the diluted (500 ml warm water) citric acid please ?

I am thinking of injecting this 0.5L into the boiler, let the rest filled from the tank, put them back, bring the boiler to the temp, rest for 2H and go from there. Please let me know if this is ok.

Thanks!

DavecUK

danielpugh I’d be tempted to say as a one-off (open rear to )separate this so as to not worrying about twisting the cable while undoing…

Definitely, as this can avoid the wires in the sensor breaking, want to avoid any flexing and twisting in that area.

LMSC I want to manually drain out the service boiler some time this month. I am going to grab a 500ml syringe. I have not done this before. I may require a lot of help.

I am thinking if removing the temp sensor is easier.
Could some one help me with detailed directions to remove the connections to drain the service boiler please ?
What tools I need ?
How do I remove the wire? Should I unscrew the bolt and hopefully, the wire come off ?
Is the copper nut turned clock wise or anti to loosen?

Perhaps, I will also do a slight descale with perhaps 50g of citic acid as it will be 6 months since the Evo got delivered. What’s the best way to inject the diluted (500 ml warm water) citric acid please ?

I absolutely would advise against doing this at this time, especially if you are using RO water (with a smidge of sodium bicarb), you should never need to descale.

Flushing out the amount of water you do already is more than ample to keep the osmotic concentration in the boiler down to sensible levels…especially considering steaming doesn’t loose huge aboutns of water. If you allow for even 30g every time you steam, that’s 20 steamings before you will need to take out 700 ml of water, for it to refresh.

Also to take this water out can be done as simply as 300 ml every week, just drawing hot water as normal, no fancy procedures required, no switching off.…and you can use that water for washing up etc..

I never descaled my Vesuvius and periodically drained water our of the steam boiler as described, as I rarely make milk drinks… and the boilers were clean as a whistle

danielpugh

@DavecUK yes - ups and downs, bit mostly ups I would say. Nothing that has detracted from my original decision/choice - i.e. I’m still happy!

Mostly sensibly laid out and relatively easy to work on (good) apart from that cable route (minor inconvenience). I like the use of hex/Allen screws. Also the use of standard parts and simple/minimal/straight pipes. Especially easy to remove main boiler which I think is the secret for longer term ownership.
Overall quality = very good/solid
Side panel for water = good /well constructed
Top panel removal = good/easy
Rear and other side panel = right pain. I would ideally have feet/pins that go into holes underneath leaving just two screws on top. This would make it much easier to remove.

Both times I have removed a side (removed to take out capacitor) and back panel wouldn’t go back on easily, and seems to need a bit of whacking, but even now slightly bodges as metal obstructing the thread.

Grip/rubber for the feet - recommended, mine slides without. Both these came off the front feet and so there were gouges in the surface even despite using towels to protect machine and surfaces while handling.
Removing the rear weight makes the machine much lighter and easier to work on

So yes - in summary good, and much less scared/more confident of opening up in future!

danielpugh

@LMSC - taking off the PID sensor was easy and as @DavecUK said a good access point. I have ordered 350ml syringe with pipe to do this.
Worth noting the PID sensor connector came loose further down (see earlier post). I’d be tempted to say as a one-off (open rear to )separate this so as to not worrying about twisting the cable while undoing…

LMSC

danielpugh I’d be tempted to say as a one-off (open rear to )separate this so as to not worrying about twisting the cable while undoing…

Thank you! Will definitely separate them out. I don’t think the copper bolt connecting the temp sensor need to come off while separating the bunch of cables, does it ?

LMSC

DavecUK Dave, thank you. I will defer as you advised. Perhaps, it can be a yearly ritual.

I do steam 350ml once a day, takes about 35-40s. It’s very rare the pump kicks off after steaming. I make it a point to draw out a small cup after every steam.

danielpugh

@LMSC - there are two small red wires coming off the temp sensor that go down the back of the machine. To separate (e.g. to remove sensor which is 17mm spanner)

1m take off the rear panel
Take off the weight - doesn’t seem too heavy until you take off the last screw so be careful
Snip the cable ties
Follow the two small cables and there should be a plastic male/female connector about half way down the machine - I disconnected and fed both parts through the middle so I always have access, and reconnected.
Put weight back on (deja vu with changing wheel).
Put back panel back on

Thereafter you can unclip the 2 wire connector to undo the sensor without winding up. The cable as the spanner turns.

LMSC

danielpugh Thank you. Your detailed guidance is valuable. The Evo community is grateful to you! 😊

Two questions for the avoidance of any doubts:

1: How did you remove the far end pipe connected to the service boiler? Because, we don’t have access to the centre bolt beneath the T-pipe unless the pressure stat or the plate separating reservoir is removed. I reckon removing the steel nut to the right of the L part (that goes down) of the pipe will free the boiler.

2: Standing in front of the machine, which direction (clock wise or anti) did you turn the 3 bolts of the pipes and the temperature sensors please ?

I am pleased your service boiler is clean! Great work. Well done.

Many thanks again!

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