I’d like to compile a list and discuss machines which warm up fast. With the ever increasing electricity prices, this becomes a good feature, as leaving the machine on all day might not be economical in certain cases. So, here we go: Decent Espresso machine, 5 minutes; Sage Dual Boiler, users reporting heat up time in less than 10 minutes; La Pavoni Europiccola and Porfessional, around 8 minutes; Vesuvius Evo Leva, 15 minutes, with dedicated group heat cartridge; Lelit machines, such as the Bianca and the Elizabeth, which heat up in approx. 17 minutes and 19 minutes respectively, due to overheating the brew boiler to 130C for a few minutes at start up. See https://coffeetime.freeflarum.com/d/1040-lelit-bianca-or-profitec-700/81

Question to @"DavecUK"#1 and users: Lelit MaraX, as it also has the overheating technique at the start, hearing the water to 140C? Isn’t that ready in 15 minutes? If so, why not? MaraX review says it heats up in 24 minutes, that’s 40% slower than the Bianca. What about just box standard HX machines? If they operate at around 126C anyway, how come those machines don’t heat up as fast as the Bianca?

A little unconventional list - But hey, we do get requests like this like one recent user Fastest ready time Graef 2 mins PS: Let me know if you would rather like them listed here than provided as URLs please!

@"LMSC"#p27177 - I think it would be best if the machines we list here are known to us or our members had experience with, rather than unverified claims on the wider internet.

4 min 30 seconds for the Decent. And all sorts of energy saving options available at a click or two on the tablet. No big boiler to keep hot either so it's a very energy efficient option.

@"MediumRoastSteam"#51 Is the topic/your question here more to do with ‘energy saving’ than ‘warm up time’ though? If not, then might be an opportunity to also discuss here. It comes down to ‘cost of warm up’ vs ‘cost to keep on once warmed up’ then. I know it’s been touched on here in other threads but I would tend to agree with the sentiment that anything that is on is using energy and so it must make sense to only turns things on when needed. There is a compromise however if it costs as much to warm up as to keep on for, say, 4 hours and if someone turns off and back on to heat up more than three times a day would it be more economical to leave on. I know when I had the Elizabeth it cost buttons due to its efficiency and small boiler sizes, and as @"DavecUK"#1 stated in his review it ‘sips’ electricity once on.

@"tompoland"#p27180 - added to the OP, rounded up to the nearest minute, thank you! @"JahLaza"#p27183 - in all honesty, I’m more interested on the second post 😊

> @"MediumRoastSteam"#p27176 Lelit MaraX, as it also has the overheating technique at the start, hearing the water to 140C? Isn’t that ready in 15 minutes? If so, why not? MaraX review says it heats up in 24 minutes, that’s 40% slower than the Bianca. Assuming the MaraX group is largely the same as the Bianca, the answer is: \- MaraX single boiler, capacity 1.8 l, 1400 W element = 778 W/l \- Bianca double boiler, brew boiler capacity 0.8 l, 1000 W element = 1250 W/l The group is heated by the (brew) boiler water, not directly, so that's what matters (and an efficient thermosyphon). To the second question ("generic" HX machine) - I suspect much the same stuff is in play, and they generally have large(ish) boilers and groups, both to provide steam capacity *and* some temperature stability.

@"MediumRoastSteam"#p27178 I get what we are saying as we can vouch for it. But, most of these machines are not unknown, although we don’t use them. These machines do interest the users (of course, not us). I therefore think, there is a place for these - however cannot be validated by us! It’s up to you if would like to add them to the unverified list or otherwise! 😊

> @"MediumRoastSteam"#p27176 Lelit MaraX, as it also has the overheating technique at the start, hearing the water to 140C? Isn’t that ready in 15 minutes? If so, why not? MaraX review says it heats up in 24 minutes, that’s 40% slower than the Bianca. > @"CoyoteOldMan"#p27185 Assuming the MaraX group is largely the same as the Bianca, the answer is: > > - MaraX single boiler, capacity 1.8 l, 1400 W element = 778 W/l > - Bianca double boiler, brew boiler capacity 0.8 l, 1000 W element = 1250 W/l Very interesting. On a side point, there might be a distinction to be made between machines that overheat and then need to cool to settle in the correct temperature (such as the Lelits) and machines that just heat up. A few minutes prior to being ready, the former will be **too hot**, so potentially could be cooled down with a flush and used sooner, while the latter would be **too cold** and nothing could be done about that. I have not done this much, but I do remember an occasion that I had to go out and wanted to pull a shot on Mara X a few minutes before the full 24 minute heat-up cycle and the machine settling on the ready-to-brew pressure/temp. I did a quick flush and the shot came out just fine as far as I remember. Here is a reminder of how the head-up cycle works on Mara X in a short time-lapse video (unfortunately I didn't include a watch, but my experience is that it indeed takes 24 minutes to complete the cycle): https://youtube.com/shorts/5DOTP7owHZg

If people have energy monitoring sockets then the best route would be to measure the power used to get to warm up, as faster isn't always lowest energy. On the topic of energy to warm up vs keep warm, it will always be cheaper to turn off, let it cool down and then heat up again. All machines lose heat and the hotter something is the higher the heat loss, because the difference between the coffee machine and ambient temperature is higher. Based on this keeping something hot always users more energy. If you turn it off and then back on a couple of hours later it won't be as cold anyway, so won't use as much energy as heating from completely cold.

Fast warm up machines

delta76

dndrich think it is quite popular tip. I do that and run a few empty shot through my naked pf to make sure group head is clean (of coffee ground)

tompoland

MediumRoastSteam oh my goodness. Extraordinary.

Pass 🤑

james65477564

CoyoteOldMan My bianca averages 1.6kWh per day. I normally have it set to switch off after 40mins but now that solar is dropping off I will shorten it to 20 and see if that works acceptably. Goal is to get <1kWh per day.

tompoland

MediumRoastSteam agree, it’s about the temperature being stable during extraction and having the basket hot so it doesn’t drop the temperature during extraction. Cooling post extraction e.g. passing through the spouts or into the cup, actually reveals more flavors. But on a cold day that may not be your preference.

delta76

This is how much my Elizabeth draws every day. Around 0.45kWh per days for 4 lattes, 2 in morning and 2 in afternoon. I make 2 double shots then froth 400-500ml of milk. This is with the grinder as it is on same plug but I guess it is drawing nothing compared to the boilers

Pompeyexile

My Sage Dual Boiler from a starting temp of 25 degrees got to 96 degrees (which is the highest it will go) in 2:23. Don’t know what the power consumption is as there is no spec sheet in the manual and I can’t find one on-line either. I guess in the winter it might take a little longer to get to temp.

DavecUK

Pompeyexile My Sage Dual Boiler from a starting temp of 25 degrees got to 96 degrees (which is the highest it will go) in 2:23. Don’t know what the power consumption is as there is no spec sheet in the manual and I can’t find one on-line either. I guess in the winter it might take a little longer to get to temp.

It’s probably in the region of 75 -90W total power consumed (over the period) to make a coffee based on your figures, if started from cold. If you put a smart plug with power measuring capability on it, or a power measuring plug, this will tell you.

I can give you a more accurate figure if you see what the power cunsumption in watts is on the rating plate underneath.

Teaboy

It’s not all about energy saving or warm up time, timer can be set so machine meets you ready to work and like Dave says wrap a towel round and it helps. I have had my Vesuvius (heats up pretty quickly) nigh on 5 years, I wonder if a decent will stand the test of time?

chlorox

According to Hoffman it would appear the record holder for fast warm up time must be the manument francesca that is ready almost immediately after it is switched on.
Other machines to give it a race other than rhe decent must be the upcoming Heylo and the Unica pro.

Cuprajake

so if were getting to temps in 20s does that negate the warming of the pf theory?

chlorox

Cuprajake
I am also a little doubtful about how accurate the temperature set for the heating elements as applied to the water produced. Hoffman didn’t seem to mention that he had tested the temperature of the water for accuracy and his description of how inexact the knob is also creates some doubts to me as to how accurate could it be.

Doram

Pardon me for being old fashioned, but how far do we really want to obsess about fast warm-up times?

Sure, technology advancement is great, but at what price? Isn’t this hobby about taking our time, enjoying the journey and savoring it, in a world that is mostly moving too fast? Do we really want coffee to be a quick fix afterthought that is available on a whim and forgotten?

If this is about saving money on energy, then yes, I totally get it. The fastest 20K Euro machine will virtually pay for itself in energy within 10,000 years (I didn’t actually calculate, so may be off by 10,000 years [or more] in either direction).

MediumRoastSteam

Doram You don’t understand. This would mean I could leave the machine on my bedside, as it looks like a fancy lamp. I can then turn it on and have a coffee straight away. :P

Jokes aside, I do value fast warmup time - and I’m talking here within reason: 1 minute, 5 minutes, 30s… All the same to me. But no, I wouldn’t pay over the odds for it.

chlorox

Doram
I don’t get it either. For me, I usually like my coffee at certain points in rhe day and i limit myselt to only a certain number of cups a day so I know well in advance when I want my shot of espresso. I don’t usually suddenly “feel like” a coffee outside these times but evne if I did, I usually have many other things occupying my time that the 15 mins my machine needs to fully warm up is already more than fast enough. So I’m clearly not in the market demographic that “needs” a machine that can warm up in seconds. But I would still question if the francesca for example is really fully warmed up in the portafilter or the screen. Especially if one were living jn a cold climate In the depths of winter these components would be very cold so there would be an instant cooling effect evne though the water is heated up by the flash heater.

delta76

Doram unless if you have a very very fixed schedule, you will find yourself in situations when you need to wait for a good espresso. And in many cases if your machine heats up in 15 minutes, you can make some latte to go in 20 and leave happily. Or your machine needs 25 minutes and you leave angrily and have a dilemma of whether you get a Starbucks instead.

Not anyone needs a fast warm up machine but if everything else equals, fast warm up time is a pretty big plus.

The fancy machine is not expensive because it has instant heating time. It is certainly a selling point, but the price is only justified by the luxury design and construction, even if we are led to believe.

Cuprajake

Im the opposite i care not for heat up time

Chriss29

Generally machines that heat up slowly have larger boilers. Does the reheating of previously boiled water affect the taste?

I would guess not, I’ve compared coffee from my Sage DB with the Cafelat Robot and prefer the coffee from the former but there could be other factors at play.

Igm45

FWIW, I have just come from a machine that requires 30 mins heat up.

My old solution was simple - timers, or when I’m out remotely turning on the smart plug.

However this did bring its own problems - if the water tank was empty it wouldn’t heat until I realised and filled it - before work this meant no coffee.

I’ve recently obtained the decent espresso machine and it’s a feature that I now value very highly, it really is remarkable

MediumRoastSteam

Igm45 However this did bring its own problems - if the water tank was empty it wouldn’t heat until I realised and filled it - before work this meant no coffee

And the fact you need to leave the PF always mounted on the group - which can be annoying if the machine already takes pretty much the whole depth of the surface, meaning the PF ends up sticking out. Yes there are other ways of heating the PF, like putting boiling water over it, or leaving on top of the machine to warm up.

And I always felt unease turning a coffee machine remotely. What if there’s a problem? The safety valve pops, or the group lever is left in the on position, or there’s an internal leak somewhere.

One of the reasons I’d rather turn my machine on and be around and fully awake.

Igm45

It’s a bit like keyless entry to your car, it’s a feature that you think doesn’t interest you but once you have it you won’t go without it!

RickO88

Cafelat Robot. As fast as your kettle!

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