New machine time!

Penance

Hello!

I’ve been wanting to upgrade from my current machine for a while and now starting to explore possibilities.

Current set up is a Eureka Specialita and a Gaggia Evolution.

Both my wife and I favour milk based drinks, for me I have normal beans and dairy, my wife has decaf and oatmilk. Also make hot chocolate using steamed milk and enjoy a straight shot most days.

At weekends I often make 3 or 4 milk drinks for visitors.

The Gaggia really struggles with this, just doesn’t have enough steam for more than a single drink. We end up having our drinks 20 minutes apart which is rather annoying.

I want to be able to make a few drinks back to back and also have more control over machine parameters, pressure and temperature, so as I can start experimenting with my brews. Also need to be able to steam more than 120ml of milk without a 20 minute wait.

Been reading a lot and I’m fairly sure a dual boiler would be best for us, though cost is a consideration. Also aesthetics, I like that look of stainless and knobs. Not a plain box. I love the E61 look.

I’m keen to advance my brewing skills but really think I cant be bothered temp surfing with a HX.

Must haves:

Good steam ability and capacity.

Temp and pressure adjustment.

Work with smart plug.

Stainless and knobs.

Machines I’m considering:

ACS Minima, this seems to be very popular. I like the looks and it ticks all boxes. Is it direct purchase only?

Lelit Bianca, also ticks all boxes but is a bit spendy for us and currently no UK stock.

Profitec Pro 600, again looks like it would serve us well but is pricey.

Leaning heavily towards the Minima due to reviews and price. Though unsure of import costs if buying direct.

Intention is to keep the Specialita, at least until I am comfortable with a new machine.

Are these good options for our needs, anything else we should consider?

CoyoteOldMan

Penance Welcome to the forum!

I think ACS are leaning towards direct buying for the UK; there may still be machines available through dealers, but they are probably running out the stock rather than ordering new ones. What you’d get in exchange for a few £ is a UK-based retailer warranty rather than a parts-only one.

Import costs may well be less than you expect, but they won’t exceed 20% VAT on the price ACS quotes, including transport. As Eiffel said, the process is very straightforward - other than waiting for your new machine at the mercy of the transport company…

Another machine worth considering - though it doesn’t tick the ‘knobs and stainless’ box - is the Lelit Elizabeth.

Cuprajake

Done some very good research, and you can to the conclusion most of us do

The Bianca is very much end game, and if you can get there I’d say money well spent.

The minima is great but will be a tad noisy. Which I didn’t like

You can always email ACS and ask the costs involved

Eiffel

If price is a factor, you may also look at the Lelit Mara-X. Temperature adjustment is limited to 3 settings but that’s probably sufficient. It has the benefit of a quieter pump over the ACS minima.

I purchase my ACS Evo Leva directly from ACS and this was a fairly simple process, and I’d have no hesitation going direct with them again.

Penance

Eiffel originally started looking at the MaraX but upgrade creep led me to DB machines. Undoubtedly it would make us happy for quite a while but I suspect we would always have a niggling ‘what if’.

Penance

Thanks.

The Bianca looks stunning but is really pushing our budget and would need some negotiation for me to sell its advantages. I’ll work on that.. Also, cant find stock at any reputable UK sellers.

I did consider the Elizabeth but just can’t get past its looks unfortunately.

Cuprajake

Penance exactly why I never got the Elizabeth.

LMSC

You have already done your home work!

You may add Vesuvius and Evo Leva to the list. Well, there is new 1 group Vostok (lever) being show cased and is probably not ready for sales. All these can be had from ACS. You may contact @Paolo_Cortese

Please see this thread!

https://coffeetime.freeflarum.com/d/1153-my-time-in-naples/54

Edit :

Do you also require a grinder ? What about your water?

Penance

LMSC the Vesuvius is nearly double our budget unfortunately.

Current grinder is a Eureka Specialita which I intend to keep, for now anyway.

Water, will likely use bottled water to start. Not sure I’m ready to tackle that subject yet! It looks bewildering to me.

LMSC

Penance Vesuvius is nearly double our budget unfortunately.

I thought it wasn’t (~£2000) when it was on deal months ago direct from ACS. They will advise you what the status is now.

Both Minima and Bianca are great. :-)

Penance

LMSC ah ok, was going by retail prices.

Will drop them an email.

PortafilterProcrastinator

I bought my Minima direct from ACS in Feb 22. All very easy/ straight forward. The machine comes well packed in a cardboard box on a small wooden pallet.

If you email and ask for the full list of options (colours/ faux wood handles) and accessories then you can get a price from them.

Parts only warranty is 2 years, but you pay postage.

I’ve been very happy with mine, despite some niggles with the steam.

I use lockhills and have descaled once so far (in addition to refilling boiler) - no signs of scale.

Penance

PortafilterProcrastinator what were the steam niggles?

LMSC

Penance import costs

Giphy - Read Happy Sunday GIF by Denyse®

PortafilterProcrastinator

Penance I paid all duty and import costs due.

At the time, this totalled the same price as the only ‘bricks and mortar’ seller in the UK who had just stopped selling them. My understanding is that if you’re in the UK the absolute best thing to do is buy direct from ACS.

If the base price has gone up, the total price will have gone up - obviously.

The steam issue seems to be inconsistent pressure/ performance but for a number of reasons I won’t go into here I’ve not bottomed it out yet.

Penance

LMSC is that a bad subject for me to raise here?

MediumRoastSteam

Penance - best to email ACS and ask them for a quote. 👍

DavecUK

Penance Only if you “want” to draw attention to things which might be beneficial, if not discussed.

Oh they even do a PVD gold finish!

Penance

MediumRoastSteam have done. I’m just unsure of duties I’d need to pay, or how to calculate it.

LMSC

Penance Please take a quote as advised. They should be able to advise the import duty as a percentage of the invoice. I think the import bill would be about 25% - VAT and import duty - of the invoice.

dndrich

I would not sell the Elizabeth short. It would be perfect for your use case. I have had mine for a year, and I love it even more every day. So easy to live with and take care of. I have no upgraditis with it. I have no need for flow controller. With the programmable preinfusion, PID, powerful boilers, and semisaturated group head all in a compact package that fits well on the counter, it is superb. If you are making milk drinks, all the better. I can make drinks back to back to back to back…no problem. Easy to clean. Easy to back flush.

Penance

dndrich I get what you’re saying but I’m subject to wife input too. Neither of us are keen on the looks.

MediumRoastSteam

Penance - if you are not keen on the looks…

MediumRoastSteam

Penance - you will have the same benefits in terms of cleaning with the minima. It has a solenoid group, so you can backflush to you heart’s content, and there’s no need to lube the cam.

The minima takes longer to warm up compared to the Elizabeth. The Minima can be retrofitted with a flow control.

The Minima has a noisy pump and box standard steam wand. The Elizabeth has a quiet pump and no burn steam wand. Both steam really well.

Remember, you have to buy what you want, as it’s you who will be using it and looking at it all day, every day.

So, if the Minima is what you want, go for it.

Just read the review from Dave on the machines you want. If possible, I’d strongly advise you to see the machines on the flesh, if you can.

Good luck!

dndrich

Penance I get it, but the advantages of the Elizabeth are hard to deny. Yes, I love the chrome look of the E61 groups and all of the flash, but there is a subtle elegance of the Elizabeth. And, remember that your local coffee house is not using E61 groups. They use saturated heads for all of the advantages they have. I too was enamored with the high reflection of machines like the Apartamento and others. Remember those machines show fingerprints and unless taken care of meticulously lose that luster. The Elizabeth with its brushed stainless always looks great. Just a quick wipe and it looks brand new. I got over that chrome need once I had the Elizabeth at my house. I am now totally delighted with it. Paired with my black Niche that sits on a Lelit knock box drawer, and it is gorgeous.