Cuprajake It’s true you rarely sink a lever shot from my Evo

All very well, but maybe it’s not the lever, but a particular lever group? In other words, it’s not all about the spring and the lever, but also the mechanics on how the group works, from pre-infusion mechanisms, water inlets to ultimately deliver.

So here we are comparing a V Evo, a spring lever machine, and a Decent machine, and it’s capability of reproducing a lever shot. My question would be… imagine, hypothetically the pressure profile software used on a Decent was used on a pumped machine with said software on a group similar to the LSM group of the V Evo? Would the shots be identical then?

    No because a pump can’t deliver that force, or so I’m led to believe

    Ive said in other posts before the group couple with the dual boilers and temp control makes it

    I’ve owned 3 levers now and the Evo is the best of them.

    Ignore the shot I ground to fine, but it’s that 2-10.5 bar is a second that I have not seen a pump do, but like I say I think it’s more to do with the way the waters pushed.

    The lever is like a hydraulic ram, with a constant pressure across the waters surface while a pump fills a chamber and the water finds its own way

    I’m not one who thinks levers are magical beasts, you can get great results with pump machines, esp dual boiler machine.

    I just noticed a step up from the Bianca to the Evo. Would you blind taste it 🤷 I’d say no.

    People like the user experience of a lever, I like the maintenance and cleaning side more.

    Ps I think the new generation of dual boiler temp control levers are the best yet. There versatile

    This kick starter looks like a good idea in theory, its not something I’d buy, too much faff.

    Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

    5 days later

    For those who like milk-based drinks as well as espresso, the lack of a steamer on the Meticulous is a downer.
    A stand alone machine that is a steamer with a boiler and wand, seems to me overkill and wasteful of energy.

    I had a look at stand alone microfoam equipment. There is a broad market of machines ranging from £20-30 up to a ridiculous £150-200 - all using a spiral wire spinner usually on a magnetic base. Some heat the milk and some do not.
    My wife has a Dualit Milk Frother - [https://www.dualit.com/products/new-milk-frother](https://) which lives up to its name, in that one gets coarse large bubbles froth, not at all a microfoam for latte that I want. This is the spiral spinner -

    The only one I found which uses a different approach is the Subminimal NanoFoamer V2 - [https://subminimal.com/products/nanofoamer?utm_campaign=%5BMadgicx%5D%20Welcome%20Email%20%7C%20Features%20and%20Benefits%20%28UJHvea%29&utm_medium=email&utm_source=%5BMadgicx%5D%2006.02%20%7C%20Pre%20%7C%20Welcome%20Email%20%7C%20Popup%20%7C%20Acquisition&_kx=edzeHaVdu_jAu8c9pm4qgsn5jvORJJFV-E3LjhVrdaM%3D.XqiQvf](https://) and it looks like it produces good microfoam in the video, but who knows?
    It does not heat the milk, but they are launching the NanoFoamer Pro on Kickstarter in March 2023 which does heat and foam in a jug automatically - [https://subminimal.com/pages/nanofoamer-pro-launch-ad](https://). No pricing yet. But if it worked well, seems like a good solution to have alongside a Meticulous.

    Having viewed a number of YouTube videos by the designer of the Meticulous, he is certainly ambitious and is currently designing a number of other coffee-based machines to go alongside the Meticulous. He acknowledged the absence of steaming on the Meticulous, and although he did not specifically reveal what else he is designing, I got the impression that milk prep was an area he would address in due course.

      jrling Nanofoamer lithium is pretty good - still working on getting the right consistancy - (and my latte art is bad at the mo 😂) but its very quick but luckily the lithium model has 2 speeds.

          jrling Dualit also do a proper steamer, but expensive ~£220.

              MattH That’s good to hear. However, you still have to heat the milk separately which is a bit of a faff. The Nano Pro jug Kickstarter though will heat and gives you 5 speed settings to do the whole process automatically. That sounds good to me.

                  Sham Yes, but it takes up quite a bit of room, takes time to heat a boiler and uses quite a bit of electricity - all of which would put me off.

                      Sham can you still buy that - when I looked into that even the dualit site seemed to have no stock ?

                        jrling I admit I have a put my one dollar down on the VIP list for it - could be good it if does a better job than a normal milk frother (which as you say just seems to make big froth rather than proper milk)

                          jrling Useful when guests who want lattes visit and you own an ECM Puristika. Just take it out of the cupboard and away you go.

                          Contact me

                            Sham Please ignore me :) now everywhere seems to have stock - cheapest I have found was £180 at Costco! It’s quite tempting….

                              The more I look at the Meticulous the more I think they are making something special. The promotional blurbs can be off putting but that hype aside, the machine itself looks pretty special.

                              All of which is to that I’ve relented and decided to back it simply to give it a whirl.

                              I won’t keep it but I’ll enjoy playing with it and passing it on to a Coffee Snobs forum member Down Under.

                              I’ll post impressions when it arrives so tune in again in about a year I guess.

                                tompoland They do look good and certainly comprehensive functionality.
                                But …. they are mechanically similar to all the others and looking at a review of one, this is what you get even with the less frothy latte disc supplied -

                                [https://photos-us.bazaarvoice.com/photo/2/cGhvdG86YnJldmlsbGV1c2E/bdf8dbbc-a1c8-52cb-86dc-8ab6e3634d11](https://)

                                That is not the silky, liquid microfoam that I can prepare on my QM Verona 2B. May be OK for guests! But £150 and not available in UK.

                                  tompoland The more I look at the Meticulous the more I think they are making something special. The promotional blurbs can be off putting but that hype aside, the machine itself looks pretty special.

                                  tompoland

                                  I agree. The designer is low key, sensible and clearly has thought very carefully about it over a long period.
                                  At $1,500 (not sure what it will be in UK) it is also very competitively priced.

                                  I’m definitely onside and eagerly awaiting the production version which is going to be less tall.

                                      I watched the video for the first time and a few thoughts spring to mind.

                                      • Certainly an Innovative design and pretty much noisless
                                      • hot water fill would be a ball ache
                                      • very very slow to heat
                                      • cold portafilter
                                      • 82C ??? way too cool IMO (is this a limitation of the design?)
                                      • Nice looking software and control system
                                      • compact size
                                      • lack of steaming ability (possibly could have been added using a thermoblock style steamer)

                                      I will be curious to see how it does.

                                      Contact me

                                        DavecUK interesting observations thanks Dave.

                                        Work is being done on the speed of heating and temperature range and making the open boiler easier to fill.

                                        Another positive is that unlike say the Argos and Weber Unifilter they are getting a lot of feedback from credible influencers/reviewers so that at time of launch punters like me have at least something to go on. The Unifilter in particular featured a complete and total dearth of reviews. It was “trust us, give us US$365 for a portafilter because you will really like it. And hey it’s ‘endlessly clean’ which is really cook. So really, just trust us cos we told you its great”. Personally I am a big fan of Douglas Weber, what he has achieved is extraordinary and he’s still out there talking to the great unwashed masses as coffee shows but for me, the lack of pre launch reviews was a deal breaker for something so pricey.

                                        Xbloom did something similar but the company who did it the the best was Gevi with their 4-1 which had the prototype reviewed and YT videos published both for the original prototype as well as for the model that incorporated suggested changes. That made the buying decisions much easier and less risky.

                                          The unifilter has kinda faded away, but the unibasket along with the sworksdesign and wafo baskets are getting more interest and are being tested in the community now. It would have been nice for some prototypes to have been out in the world before the launch. For me it seems like anything above a medium light roast won’t see a practical benefit, maybe even light roasts only.

                                          The meticulous is a great concept and I hope they manage to bring the product to market because it will create some competition. Lack of steam is a shame, but focussing on the espresso first isn’t a bad way to go.

                                          Coffee Roaster. Home: Sage Dual Boiler, Niche Zero, Ode v2 (SSP), 1zpresso ZP6 Work: Eagle One Prima EXP, mahlkonig e80s, Mazzer Philos and lots more

                                          Coincidentally a forum member here in Australia asked me if I would review the Unifilter if he sent me one. So there is one on the way ETA next week so I can let you know what all the fuss is about (other than the marketing 😁)