Shipping July released today. it could of course be an April fools joke. Albeit a strange one… https://www.nichecoffee.co.uk/products/niche-duo?variant=43187239846019

@"Igm45"#p40972 Not an April fools joke….people have ordered.

Some time to launch! 😏 I see from the specs that it's physically bigger than the Zero….assuming this is - at least in part - to house a bigger motor for the flats?

I still believe it's April fool's, too good to be true….

@"[unknown]"#p41017 Have you seen he full manual you can download and read ?

@"MattH"#p41026 https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0081/2076/2450/files/N685_INSTRUCTION_BOOK_ROW_83F_1_080323_WEB.pdf?v=1680015642

Two excellent videos from Jake. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKdyBJ7TkhU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C90i5RVoBpo

@"DavecUK"#p41257 There are a couple of others there now too. (why does the plug change colour 🤔???)

> @"Del_UK"#p41290 (why does the plug change colour 🤔???) Dunno? RH Lead swaps colour as well in the starting clip

Can I chuck my hat into the ring? Right, first off, this is not an engineering review. I was lucky enough to be asked by Niche back in October, to accept the latest version of the Niche Duo. I had to sign an NDA and that was that. A couple of days later, a package turned up and I thought, I recognise that. On inspecting the packaging, it is quite clearly designed with the Zero experience in mind. The packaging has instructions printed on it for starters. Once you open the outer box, there is a strap/handle to help you lift the inner box meaning that you do not have to tip it upside down to force it out! I received a gleaming white model that arrived with espresso burrs fitted to it. A quick glance through the comprehensive handbook to make sure that there was nothing I needed to be aware of, and coffee here we come! When I dial in a new grinder, I always pull the first shot at whatever it arrives set to and take my reference from there. The third shot was spot on. 16 gms on an espresso setting takes me 16 seconds. I did not suffer from any static, the grounds were nice and fluffy. I believe the burrs originate from Mazzer (both espresso and brewed). Eventually, I thought it was time to try swapping the burrs over. Again, no help from Niche. They selected me as tester for their idiots instructions, and I feel well qualified for that role. I have made a video that I will post and it took me 70 seconds or so to swap over. You raise the lid, unscrew the silver dial, remove the screw to tighten down the top burr set, then remove it. Push down on the bottom burr set and remove. The process is then repeated with the brewed burrs (these are a different colour, blue) in reverse of course. I am deliberately keeping this summary vague! I have no idea as to how they get a big flat to be retention free. Having swapped the burrs over many times, and since access allows with ease, whenever I clean it out the retention is minimal. If I remember I will weigh it at some point but as any Niche Zero owners knows, you learn to trust your machine and just accept the claims! https://youtu.be/63Iv5gUy1JQ https://www.instagram.com/reel/CqlKJZjg_ZPsfdrHkp5cDIoL_KjSXhE5E5st-00/?igshid=Mzc1MmZhNjY=

@"Del_UK"#p41290 because I have a white extension lead, which I took out of the vid 😂

Niche duo - 83mm flat

Loonster

How do you get enough torque?

On mine, the burr spins as you tighten it.

Parm

Loonster Correct. It’s not possible to apply more torque using the tightening method demonstrated in their videos, as the burr will spin past the point of resistance. I’ve been able to apply more torque by using my fingers to apply counter-pressure on the bottom burr so I can increase the torque applied with the hex wrench. Even with this technique, the bottom burr has become loose again after a week or two of usage.

In my mind, one shouldn’t need to use any sort of excessive tightening method given that one of the main selling points of the Duo is quick and easy burr swaps. @dfk41 certainly if the screw ends up being the primary problem, that would be great news and a quick replacement. Either way, my goal has been to ensure Niche recognizes it’s not an isolated issue and looks into the best way to fix this for those experiencing it.

tompoland

Here you go Loonster I use a plastic spudger (see https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spudger ) to stop the burr turning as I tighten it. These are very useful tools for use in close proximity to metal surfaces that you want to keep in their original condition (the spudger is the black plastic stick that I’m holding on the left; they come in many shapes but mostly a similar size.)

Spudgers are as cheap as chips on aliexpress

Cuprajake

Just measure the screw. I don’t have calipers at home

Twotone2

I cleaned my grinder yesterday it took me about five minutes and was a pleasure to do but the main reason was to check the screw/bolt and it was tight and hasn’t moved since the last time I swapped the burrs over which was about a month ago.

Reassembling everything was pretty easy I can get a good tighten on the screw without even holding the bottom burrs in fact I’m sure the bottom burrs won’t or don’t turn anti-clockwise when I’m tightening the bolt there’s definitely resistance on the bottom burrs when I’m tightening the bolt.

My grinder has a manufacturer date of July I think, I’d need to check the box but I’m sure it’s July.

Parm

Twotone2 Interesting. On my unit, there is a very clear point where once enough torque is applied (and it’s not that much), the bottom burr with rotate with the rotation of the hex wrench, which caps out how much torque I can apply naturally. The amount of torque generated here typically only keeps my bottom burr locked in place for a few days at most.

@dfk41 I’m not sure if you’ve misinterpreted the tone of the conversation or think some of us are lying, incompetent, or what. I think most of us are just trying to ensure our grinders are working properly. If you think this is user error, please let me know what you think I have wrong and I’ll be happy to give your suggestion a try.

@Cuprajake, I think I have calipers deep in the recesses of a drawer somewhere. I’ll do what I can to get a measurement!

Gagaryn

It is a bit of an oversight in design. The grinders selling point is ease of burr swap but this necessitates firmly torquing down a screw in a spinning carrier each swap which clearly many people can’t do without resorting to wedging the burrs with a plastic stick. Not a particularly elegant solution but it works.

The problem with using a lock washer as a workaround is that the screw will need to be firmly tightened before the lock washer will function, and the issue is that people are struggling to firmly fasten the screw! It also would be easily lost by caffeine deprived early morning users!

A similar issue exists with some Dremel rotary tools - it’s impossible to tighten the chuck as the motor spins when force is applied. They fixed that by fitting a button operated cam that temporarily locks the chuck. A slightly more complicated solution could use a spring loaded clutch type mechanism where the screw would need to be pushed down to loosen or tighten and the pressure of pushing down would lock the burrs.

Or simply use low strength thread locker.

dfk41

Gagaryn Several of us tested this grinder extensively from October 2022 in a home environment. I know for a fact that there were many many prototypes. This ‘problem’ did not crop up and I would like to place a bet that I have swapped burrs over more times that anyone on the forum who has bought a retail unit

DavecUK

Gagaryn The problem with using a lock washer as a workaround is that the screw will need to be firmly tightened before the lock washer will function,

It’s partly why I suggested a red fibre washer as an alternative, just in case.

Cuprajake

Gagaryn
It’s not an overnight

This issue has only just cropped up,
No one will see microns on a screw thread but it could be bottoming out

Like I keep asking measure the screw thats doing it and I would likely think a non affected grinders screw will be shorter.
If I can remember I’ll bring calipers home to check my screw

tompoland

dfk41 Unfortunately, some of these issues, only ocurr when there is a larger volume of units in the market.

Loonster

DavecUK It’s partly why I suggested a red fibre washer as an alternative, just in case.

And maybe grindable Incase the user unknowingly drops it and forgets to retrieve it. A metal washer might damage the grinder.

MediumRoastSteam

DavecUK It’s partly why I suggested a red fibre washer as an alternative, just in case.

I don’t have the problem, so just seeing it as an outsider. Although the washer is an alternative
, it doesn’t make it right. It should just work as designed by the manufacturer. Now, if Niche then reviews the design and supplies a fibre washer as part of the package and upgrade their instructions, then I accept as a an official solution. Until then, either there’s a problem with some members grinders (screw, shaft, whatever) or there’s a slight oversight in the design. Given some of the feedback and the number of units sold, I’m inclined to think it’s the former and I hope it’s resolved swiftly by Niche as their customer service is excellent.

tompoland

DavecUK would you be good enough to provide a link for an example, please. I might try this.

dfk41

MediumRoastSteam I hope it’s resolved swiftly by Niche as their customer service is excellent.

Ah, so the beef is they are not resolving it fast enough then. Crikey, I would hate to think what your attitude would be like if you had one of the affected grinders…….LOL

MediumRoastSteam

dfk41

dfk41 Ah, so the beef is they are not resolving it fast enough then.

Did I say that? I said that I hope they resolve it swiftly. I never said that they are not. I know they are on it, but a solution hasn’t been found yet. So, it’s “in progress” and, I repeat, I hope they resolve it swiftly.

And I’m out of this thing. It seems that any comment I make about the Duo, expressing my own opinion about the product, is always picked on by you, almost as if you have a vested interest. Maybe you want me to say what a marvellous fest of engineering this is, what a perfect grinder that is. Nothing is perfect, and, amidst the others in the field and at that price, the Duo seems to be the best of them. Don’t get me wrong here. I really liked the grinder (clue: I have a Duo and a Zero!!!!!!) and I chose this grinder over others because I know it would be well built and there was a lot of input from Dave on this, going backs and forwards, improving on it for months if not years prior to release. You don’t need to lecture me on this. I know how good a product it is. I just said that there is a problem (for some, I don’t have it) and I hope it gets resolved soon. That’s all.

Enjoy the weekend DFK. And, before you ask, my blood pressure is fine. 👋😉

dfk41

Parm Look, I have no issue, despite the fact that I do not always agree with some! I am not saying that the Duo does not have this issue when obviously for some, it does. What I am suggesting, is that Niche are now looking into this so give them a chance. If a screw does not tighten up in a hole properly, then it is unlikely to have a complicated answer.

Cuprajake

Parm it shouldn’t need that much torque though, it’s only holding the burr down so just a nip, the burr is turning clockwise so it should tighten the screw regardless.

So in this case there is something OBS wrong with it.

This shouldn’t happen, I’m lucky enough to have had in effect two duo and never had a problem with either but when you are spending any money be it £60 or £600 it should be right out of the box,

No manufacturer has immunity from this be it niche, acs, londinium,zerno they all have problems and it’s about working out how to stop it

I could write a whole list of issues from the above manufacturers but it’s not worth trawling mud.

Twotone2

Parm I

Aye I’ve just tried tightening the bolt again there and you’re right the burr starts turning when you keep tightening the bolt after it’s screwed right down onto the burr.

I stop tightening the bolt when it tightens onto the burr and it’s never loosened off yet.

I measured the bolt it’s 39mm to the underside of the dome.

Tony

Igm45

I think the defensiveness exhibited over niche as a brand is why there has been claims of bias on this forum towards Niche and against other brands.

I think if this were a Londinium grinder for example and their customer service response was ‘we haven’t seen this before’ (despite evidence to the contrary) and ‘just tighten the screw’ I’m not convinced the forums response would be the same.

I know this is going off thread but that’s just my two pence. I have no loyalties towards any brands/grinders however personally I’ve not been that impressed by Niche.

DavecUK

Igm45 I think the defensiveness exhibited over niche as a brand is why there has been claims of bias on this forum towards Niche and against other brands.

I think you will find that’s true for all owners….those owner glasses make a big difference to perception. The more money paid, the better those glasses get. 😁

Loonster

Cuprajake it shouldn’t need that much torque though, it’s only holding the burr down so just a nip, the burr is turning clockwise so it should tighten the screw regardless.

It’s better practice to have friction to be the primary method of transferring torque from the shaft to the mating object. The keyway is supposed to be a backup. The screw is how friction is applied.

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