Says it all, buy fresh beans and shot pulls within 'limits' 18g/36g 25-30 secs with preinfusion of 6 secs. First drip appears at the right time yet still the shot looks lacking. So, quick question, is the lack of crema a problem or not. Am i wrong in believing that the beans supplied are fresh despite being labelled as roasted within the past few days and allowed a couple to further degas. Crema, after all as i understand, rightly or wrongly, a component part of the degassing process? I suppose i just want to see a nicely coloured cream topping and its not happening so where do i start here? Is there a specific roast that i can use as a tester just to confirm that i'm not going off the rails here?

@"skylark"#p53720 does it taste good? I remember James said something like creama is not a seal of quality, but the lack of it is an indicator that something is off. Which I agrees with. I would suggest: * Grind finer to see if it improves anything * Buy another coffee from another roaster. It could be the bean is old (the roaster might make a mistake or is simply lying, or they have a bad batch)

Lack of crema, a problem?

Cuprajake

What are the beans,

Basket, any screens etc

skylark

Coffee Compass Bourbon blend, 18g, vst with 1mm puck screen. Any use?

MediumRoastSteam

skylark Coffee Compass Bourbon blend

You should get heaps of crema with that coffee.

Any chance this is happening after a backflush with detergent? If so, make sure you rinse well as detergent kills crema.

Remove the puck screen or dose 17g. maybe there isn’t enough head space?

What is the extraction time and weight?

What’s the water temperature set to?

delta76

skylark does it taste good?

I remember James said something like creama is not a seal of quality, but the lack of it is an indicator that something is off. Which I agrees with.

I would suggest:

Grind finer to see if it improves anything
Buy another coffee from another roaster. It could be the bean is old (the roaster might make a mistake or is simply lying, or they have a bad batch)

JahLaza

delta76 but the lack of it is an indicator that something is off. Which I agrees with

I don’t agree, well, entirely! Yes I believe it’s an indication of freshness due to CO2 release after roasting. I regularly get a medium to light roast which has very little crema and is really tasty. The lack of crema features whether it’s one week or four weeks post roasting. Now I only drink it as americano, I guess espresso wise the crema becomes more important. That said, I was on this coffee for about 3 weeks until Monday, when I started on a darker roast, 2 weeks post roast and it had loads of crema. There is something pleasing about the crema….

delta76

JahLaza I haven’t never had a super light roast but light medium still has plenty of crema for me. The video in question

Now I know not everything James says is gospel but he is a renowned expert and he clearly did his research. As he said (and i quoted him from memory, so I can be wrong), “something is off”, not “wrong”. The biggest factor is still taste, then smell. If those are good and you are happy then all is good. But a normal espresso should have crema, and it is aesthetically pleasing to many people

skylark

MediumRoastSteam Nope, not a backflushing issue. Dosing 18gm into 18gm vst basket. Even with 1mm puckscreen there’s just over half the basket unfilled so plenty of headroom. Water temp at 93c and first drip happens ‘just’ before pump kicks back in so seems in the ballpark. I’ll try a reduced dose and see what happens, I like the puck screen.

Cuprajake

I can get good crema with light roasts.

It’s so bean dependant.

A video speaks a 1000 words in this case

skylark

Thanks.

I’ve not got a ‘palate’ for tasting coffee and normally drink a milky drink of any persuasion when it comes to a morning shot. The shot itself acts just fine in that it’s hitting all of the parameters so grind isn’t an issue that I’m concerned about. I’ve not used CC before and am not to pointing any fingers at what’s been supplied. The beans ‘look’ fresh, delivered 2days after the roasting date on the bag so all again appears fine. Its just the lack of any crema and the appearance of the shot that makes me think, why? Is anyone able to point me at a roast which they know to give a decent crema, notwithstanding the good or bad of it, and I can give it a go. Otherwise I’m back at the starting gate it seems with my choices. I’m sure this is purely a learning curve and comes down to what I like vs my expectations. I see crema on virtually each and every shot I view apart from my own. Just asking the question, is it me or the beans? In my own mind it isn’t me but hey-ho I could be wrong eh! Nobody’s perfect!

delta76

skylark if you just want to test crema, go pick lavazza at supermarket. I have no idea about roaster in UK but maybe try the most popular and their best seller coffee?

MediumRoastSteam

skylark is it me or the beans?

I’ve used those beans many time. If coffee compass blends don’t have any crema, then I really don’t know what do.

As Jake said, a video speaks a thousand words. Doubt the beans are the culprit, but hard to say without seeing anything.

Cuprajake

What water are you using?

skylark

Cuprajake OZero

MediumRoastSteam

skylark I like the puck screen

I’m not saying you should not use the puck screen. What I suggest is that you go back to the bare minimum to figure out what’s causing it. I’d remove the pre-infusion phase also just to try and diagnose the problem. Dose, tamp, lock. No pre infusion, no puck screen. If you get crema, you know what the possible culprits are. If you don’t, then it’s something else.

Elcarajillo

Temperature either too high or too low can affect crema, also pump pressure.
Try brewing without preinfusion, see if it makes a difference.
C C ’s beans are usually pretty good for crema.
Do you get any crema ? is it dark / tan does it fade quickly

skylark

Thanks to all. I’ll take the points raised and get back. Pump pressure is at about 10.25bar, still as stock. Worth dropping this or not as some say its that way to compensate for less than accurate gauges?? Yes, you’ve hit the nail on the head, crema is lacklustre a nd disappears almost immediately. Looks miserable as in stale beans miserable so I’ll make a couple of tweaks and then move on from CC just as a proving exercise.

Elcarajillo

skylark Give C C a ring and speak to Richard, explain what is happening and ask his advice .

Cuprajake

If they were stale you would be grinding very fine and the shot would be running quick no pressure.

skylark

Cuprajake not stale then.

Twotone2

I had this issue when my coffee machine was blocked so not enough water getting to the beans/grind and the espresso was cold too or too cool.

The coffee was pretty shocking to be honest but I put up with it for ages convincing myself it was something I was doing, must have wasted a few kg of beans over a few months.

There’s a thread here about it I eventually solved the problem with the help of guys on here.

delta76

Twotone2

Elektra T1 Heat exchanger Espresso Machine Cool espresso - Coffeetime - A non-commercial coffee forum (freeflarum.com) this thread?

As OP’s machine is new I think limescale is not a real concern. I think OP said the espresso tastes ok as well ?

Twotone2

delta76 As

Wasn’t limescale with my machine, we have soft water here, it was a small jet (jicleur) that was blocked.

I bought beans from a few different roasters at the time and all of the beans were poor through my machine, one of the roasters actually sent me free beans after I contacted him thinking it was his beans that were off but of course it wasn’t.