Mara X no steam pressure

fl13dl1c3

Hi all,

I have a 2.5 year old Mara X that isn’t building any steam pressure. After turning on the machine for 1 hour, the steam pressure gauge sits at 0, and it doesn’t ever move during warm-up. The machine feels hot to touch. The pump engages when I brew - the water that comes out of the grouphead is hot, but not scalding hot. The temperature light on the front of the machine just keeps blinking the entire time.

After 1+ hour or so, I hear and see steam hissing out from the bottom of the drip tray. I opened up the vacuum breaker and replaced the insides (o-ring, teflon seat, & plunger) for good measure, but nothing changed. Still no steam pressure, and I only see some steam hissing out of the drip tray and hear/see the vacuum breaker bubbling.

I also took off the top temperature sensor (I believe this is the steam temp probe?) and it looks clean - no signs of scale.

Any insights as to what I should check next to fix this?

Thanks!

DavecUK

fl13dl1c3 After 1+ hour or so, I hear and see steam hissing out from the bottom of the drip tray.

I wonder where this is coming from then?

DavecUK

What happens when you open the steam valve?

fl13dl1c3

DavecUK

Nothing comes out of the steam valve. Nothing out of the hot water tap either.

fl13dl1c3

DavecUK

Looks like the vacuum breaker tube leads to the drain valve in the front of the machine in the drip tray

DavecUK

fl13dl1c3 Looks like the vacuum breaker tube leads to the drain valve in the front of the machine in the drip tray

It does, hence my confusion, when you say no steam or hot water?

How much is it hissing, very quiet, or loud and lots of steam?

fl13dl1c3

DavecUK

It’s more on the lower and quiet end. Slowly releasing steam from the drain valve.

The water coming out of the group head is hot. Since there is no steam pressure, nothing will come out of the steam wand or hot water wand.

DavecUK

fl13dl1c3 It’s more on the lower and quiet end. Slowly releasing steam from the drain valve.

If it’s definitely releasing this from the vacuum breaker and there is no pressure, it must be super quiet. I would take the case off and make sure. It sounds as if the temp sensor on the boiler is working up to a point and telling the machine it’s up to temp when it isn’t. This would lead to not super hot brew water which cools quickly as you let it run, a group that doesn’t seem as hot as usual. If this sounds correct, then the best thing to try would be a new temperature sensor.

P.S. Don’t ever remove them to check for scale etc.. as often the act of removal can break the wires leading to the thermistor.

fl13dl1c3

DavecUK

Should I look into replacing the thermostat on the top of the boiler or on the bottom?

Another new discovery - I changed the mode to the standard HX mode, and set the PID to the highest level. After some time the steam pressure built up to 1.25bars. That seems a bit low to me, I recall the steam pressure to be higher at the max temp for HX mode.

In any case, it’s not consistent that I can get the machine to build the steam pressure with HX mode. I’ve turned the machine on and off multiple times and I can’t consistently get it to behave like this.

Could something be faulty with the GICAR box?

DavecUK

fl13dl1c3 Try changing the one at the top of the boiler.

fl13dl1c3

DavecUK

I just received my replacement part and am sad to report that changing the temperature probe at the top of the boiler did not change anything.

Any suggestions next? My reseller doesn’t have any lead to check what’s next either. I am also planning to email Lelit on the side to see if they may have any thoughts.

DavecUK

fl13dl1c3 At the moment it sounds like the Gicar box, although I suppose it could be the temp sensor in the thermosyphon loop. Might be worth changing that for the one you removed from the top of the boiler?

fl13dl1c3

DavecUK I swapped the temp sensor from the top of the boiler to the thermospyhon loop, no changes in behavior. There was a small layer of scale on the thermospyhon loop temp sensor for what it’s worth.
I want to descale for good measure, but I can’t build enough pressure reliably to empty the boiler with the hot water tap for a full descale.

As for the Gicar box, I’ve been meaning to upgrade this to the newer version, so I ordered the V2 Gicar box at the same time as the new temp sensor. I replaced the v1 Gicar box to v2, but no changes afterwards either.

DavecUK

fl13dl1c3 s for the Gicar box, I’ve been meaning to upgrade this to the newer version, so I ordered the V2 Gicar box at the same time as the new temp sensor. I replaced the v1 Gicar box to v2, but no changes afterwards either.

So you had the older software with the standard steam boost and HX mode…the newer software giving you X-Mode coffee and no more HX mode?

fl13dl1c3

DavecUK That’s right, the new software has the steam boost mode and coffee mode. Changing to either mode does not affect the steam pressure at this point.

DavecUK

fl13dl1c3 Is it possible the switch for the different modes has a loose connection and it’s stuck in coffee mode?

fl13dl1c3

DavecUK I don’t think so. Before I swapped Gicar units, I was able to switch to HX mode where it intermittently got hot enough to get to 1.25 bars of steam pressure when I had it at the highest PID temp.

In that mode and temperature it didn’t consistently build to that pressure when I turned it on. I was only able to replicate it 2x out of many times I cycled the machine on and off. But 1.25bars at the highest PID temp is still lower than expected.

MediumRoastSteam

So you swapped the temp sensor around: no luck;
You replace one of the temp sensor: no luck;
You replace the Gicar box: no luck;
You flip the switch to switch mode: no luck.

Maybe you have a faulty heating element?

fl13dl1c3

MediumRoastSteam If the machine gets hot, shouldn’t that mean that the heating element works? It just doesn’t get hot enough to produce enough steam to build pressure.

If I was to check the heating element, I would need to get a multimeter right?

Doram

fl13dl1c3 - did you get any reply from Lelit? (following this with interest and hoping you get it solved!).

MediumRoastSteam

fl13dl1c3 - I’m just going by elimination here. You pretty much changed everything, apart from the heating element. I don’t really understand enough, but I don wonder whether your heating element is not heating up fully.

I think you’ll need a multimeter to check it. But I don’t know how to check it, if that makes sense.