I can’t seem to get rid of unpleasant harshness and dryness

MediumRoastSteam · 5 Jan

MuddyOne instrument and spending 500£ in a scace device is not something I will do considering machine is under warranty and it’s retailer job to do so.

That’s right.

The PID numbers won’t change much. All it MIGHT do is stop the machine from overheating when idling, that’s all. As Adrian said, someone needs to take a look at your machine pragmatically. I hope the retailer can help you with that. The scary part is that you are not alone, and there are others, very clearly, struggling with a machine of such calibre. You shouldn’t be experiencing what you are experiencing. Looks like ECM/Profitec, whatever they did…. They managed to mess up somewhere.

Adrianmsmith · 5 Jan

MuddyOne

You dont need that just to check water temp.

Yes that’s the ultimate.

i leave the Ferrari at home when going to Tesco!!

I realise you dont have anything to habd to use but a cheap one will do with a wire couple. Its not like you need it all day every day.

Can lend you my fluke if you want . I never use it.

MMuddyOne · 5 Jan

Adrianmsmith Thanks ,I’ll get one from my work , it’s old device but I heard it’s very accurate. I used it in the past with sage barista touch and it gave me readings reported by other people who’s been testing temp .

I’ll report temperature in a couple days. 👍

MediumRoastSteam · 5 Jan

MuddyOne - also, on that same Reddit thread, they talk about flow rates. The OP opted for a machine without the flow control valve and says the flow rate is crazy. Consider reducing your flow control valve by another quarter turn and see if that improve things (I.e: lengthen the shot by a couple of seconds) including taste.

MMuddyOne · 5 Jan

MediumRoastSteam can you say whenever you get a chance how many ml your machine delivers in 10s?

Mine does about 100-110ml with one and a quarter turn- which is meant to be default for brewing.

MediumRoastSteam · 5 Jan

MuddyOne Mine does about 100-110ml with one and a quarter turn- which is meant to be default for brewing

Mine is a vibe pump so likely to be very different.

11ml/s is what the OP says is good in that thread, so it looks like you are good. Apparently the OP’s machine delivered 17ml/s!

Adrianmsmith · 5 Jan

MuddyOne

@MediumRoastSteam

This is pretty much accepted as standard FOR A ROTARY PUMP ECM etc

11g per second so a can of coke , 330g in 30 seconds

MMuddyOne · 5 Jan

Adrianmsmith so 110 in 10s which is precisely what is mine doing, seems alright.

I have posted another thread on home-barista I’m hoping for find another profitec drive user to share experience, there must be some out there.

MMuddyOne · 6 Jan

MediumRoastSteam I just received an email from retailer basically telling me to adjust off set, pretty much to do what Jake with the link to instructions posted.

“ if you get flash boiling at 93 degrees set off set by minus 6”

How should I respond to this or just take the advice?

MediumRoastSteam · 6 Jan

MuddyOne - Did you explain the problem, i.e.: that the flash boiling is only happening after the machine is left idling for a while?

MMuddyOne · 6 Jan

MediumRoastSteam yeah I did , sent that email before Christmas break and they may have forgot about that fact. But I sent them a reminder now with screenshot of that email, and a video I recorded ( I didn’t record first video after 30 minutes)

Basically what we talked is now reflected on devices , I switched machine on , set to 95 put the wire into ports filter and after 30 minutes it showed 95 degrees, plus minus half degree. But after another 30 minutes it showed that :

I sent them this video and explained that 30 minutes after turning on it was showing 95 degrees, now 99.

MediumRoastSteam · 6 Jan

MuddyOne - Excellent! I hope they “get it” (i.e.: how can a machine like fluctuate the temperature like that when idle?) - It’s a dual boiler machine, not an HX!

I hope you find resolution and that your retailer sees the problem (rather than pretend everything is just fine). And I hope you don’t hear the usual: “Oh, that’s just perfectly normal. I wouldn’t worry about that. Those machines need a cooling flush after being idle for longer than 30 minutes”. No, no, no. It’s a dual boiler. It should not behave like that.

Good luck.

MMuddyOne · 7 Jan

MediumRoastSteam

This is the answer I got from them

“The coffee boiler temp will heat up the longer the machine is on, so perhaps best to put the machine in eco mode when not needing it to make coffee, or when not used for longer periods.”

I replied that if machine is not keeping stable temperature that was set then that’s not how pid should work and is certainly malfunctioning.

But setting the offset to minus four helped keep 95 degrees ,I need to wait till tomorrow for machine to cool down now to see if that is the case both after 30 minutes and 1h

Cuprajake · 7 Jan

Having a dual boiler that doesn’t keep stable temp is pointless, may as well have bought an hx and saved the money.

Bit of a crap answer.

How long does the machine take to heat up.

MMuddyOne · 7 Jan

Cuprajake i test after 30 minutes and then it shows temperature that was set , after another 30 minutes it charges up again.

I suspect that it’s fully charged after 20-25 minutes already.

Adrianmsmith · 7 Jan

Cuprajake

@MuddyOne

Agree with Jake. Bad answer from your dealer.

I had a synchronika which isnt that different control wise to what you have and never had any temperature issues

Does the reported temperature change or just the actual.

MMuddyOne · 7 Jan

Adrianmsmith

Sorry I’m not sure about your question:)

If you set the temperature to x, after 30 minutes it will be x and obviously that’s the time it should take machine to fully charge up already . But after a while it will raise by another 2-4 degrees, can’t say after how much exactly as I test in 30 minutes gaps after turning it on, it may 40, 50 minutes after turning on. No wonder I’ve been experiencing bitter espresso if I was brewing dark roast at 93 degrees thinking it’s 88-89 or medium at 97-99 .

MediumRoastSteam · 7 Jan

MuddyOne The coffee boiler temp will heat up the longer the machine is on, so perhaps best to put the machine in eco mode when not needing it to make coffee, or when not used for longer periods.”

As predicted.

MediumRoastSteam “Oh, that’s just perfectly normal. I wouldn’t worry about that. Those machines need a cooling flush after being idle for longer than 30 minutes”. No, no, no. It’s a dual boiler. It should not behave like that.

Total nonsense. As Jake said… It’s a dual boiler. One boiler is for brew water (i.e.: Should be kept at brewing temperature at all times) - the other other boiler is for steaming. There’s no reason for the brew boiler to overheat over time - That ’s for a Heat Exchanger machine behaviour.

They are fobbing you off.

Total nonsense.

Adrianmsmith · 7 Jan

MuddyOne

Does the pid still show the set temperature or does that change as well.

Or

Is it just that actual water that is hotter then what the machine says it is

Ie is it something along the lines of faulty relay or faulty control logic

MMuddyOne · 7 Jan

Adrianmsmith well I will run more tests in following days now that I have this device but, last test it went up to 95 degrees with off set now -4 , but after 10-15 s dropped to 90 I wanted to actually ask if that how it should look like, I understand that flushing drops temp , but that also means that after few seconds we are not brewing at regular temperature.

I will run more tests tomorrow.