All, Hope you don’t hate me for posts like this! We do end up folks discussing manual grinders here. This bloke compares 4 manual grinders (obv with Niche) for espresso. Please ignore the Niche Zero comparison. He seems using a medium roast that has a brighter body (stone fruit and blackberry). He could have as well shown another comparison with a low-acidic coffee. It is what it is. Please post if there is another interesting hand-grinder comparison video. Please fast forward to 22.30+ for the comparison of the shots. https://youtu.be/95DOWxV7a9k

Interesting vid thanks. The Kinu M47 Classic was James Hoffman's preferred hand grinder from the range he tested however he briefly mentioned that the majority of his testers preferred the Commandante. The 1Zpresso JX-Pro seems to have a legion of fans here in Australia and I've only heard very positive reports from owners so I suspect that's a pretty darned good grinder too. I've had the Porlex which I didn't enjoy so much and I've stuck with the Kinu M47 Classic as my travel grinder. Based on Hoffman's review and this one, it would be hard to go wrong with the any of them with the possible exception of the Porlex which some may find produces a thinner espresso without a shorter lasting taste. Much though I like the Kinu, as soon as the Mazzer Omega lands in Australia I'll be trying it. Mazzer burrs (Niche Zero 63mm) seem to out perform Italmill burrs (Kinu 47mm) - thanks @"DavecUK"#1 for the heads up on the difference which is marked. The biggest challenge I have with the 83mm conical benchtop hand grinder is seasoning the darned thing. Dialling it in was all over the shop for the first two kilos of beans and that's a LOT of grinding when it's all done by hand. So if you do a get a hand grinder, just be aware that your pour times may be inconsistent for a while, although with smaller burrs my guess is that they will season a lot faster than the 83mm monsters.

@"tompoland"#p19514 I do think the C40 Red click and Jx are the most popular hand grinders. I do have the JX Pro; I pulled the trigger when I saw Dave’s video — that was even before I started lurking and joining the other coffee forum. The JX is the only grinder I use for espresso and pour overs. The shots are always on the brighter side of things - not so much but by some margin. I would like an electric some time down the line. We look forward to your full review of the Omega and perhaps a shoot out video of manual vs electric! Please take your time though! 😊

Once the argos and nurri arrive, I'm going to host an open day for local Australian forum members to come and try various grinders and machines, so that may be a good opportunity to do some shoot outs between a few of the grinders and see what the consensus is. Should be fun. Tickets anyone? (no charge of course and any stray Brits will be welcome).

> @"tompoland"#p19553 host an open day Very nice Indeed. I think we have a few fellow Aussies on this forum who may be interested in. @"Paolo5"#71 is one such member, if I am not wrong. I think there are quite a few. You may want to create the Australian Open thread to get the attention of fellow country men and women!

@"LMSC"#p19601 great idea I'll hang off though until I have the machines. ETA of both still very uncertain.

It's a bit odd that Josh at AB didn't taste any shots when "dialling in". Best to make the best (or at least best of 3 when in the ball park?) tasting shot with each grinder, then compare.

Was this on YouTube 😂 The mazzer grinder does look well made

Mazzer grinder so hot, I want it so bad

Not when you look at the price… €345 + shipping for the 'base' model (without the accessories, for which they want another €35). Don't get me wrong - it's comparable to the Kinu and others, but I find it's a heck of a lot of money for what it is (they are).

Manual grinders comparison

europa

I have had the J-Max for seven months and am fairly happy with it. Although i have no experience with any other grinder (manual or electric), there are a few things that i have noticed:

It has to be recalibrated after cleaning. Simple enough you may think. However, the zero point will be slightly different each time; so some dialing in is needed after every recalibration.
Although each click is only eight microns, i wish this were even less as dialing in espresso would be easier. That said, i am not sure any other hand grinder is better on this front.
I get the impression that the settings can drift a little over time, so small adjustments are needed.
*

Enea_

I hadn’t seen the Mazzer before. Wow! Looks incredible. Wonder if the two different burr sets on offer taste different?

I had a portaspresso Rosco, which was really (really!) great, but which sadly got destroyed in my last move (along with a whole box of my better half’s favourite china 😢). I replaced it with a Kinu Phoenix & it’s generally good, but lately getting on my nerves as I feel it could be a little more precise (in the past 6 months all coffees I’ve bought are within 0.9-1.0).

I’ve seen the J-Max online, which might address the problem. Is it really that precise?

CafeNoir

Enea_… long story short, yes. I’ve owned mine for at least 6 months now (Time passes very quickly, can’t be more precise)

I use it about 3 times a day, 2 weeks out of 3 working on a remote site with my Flair. It is just so much better for espresso than my Feld2 in precision and general handling. The crank arm makes the 48mm burrs less of a challenge than I’d expected….not saying it’s that easy for lighter roasts but well manageable.

I haven’t noticed the same issue about adjustment after cleaning, just appreciate the repeatability and build qualify, it’s designed and built by engineers and I feel it shows.

Feld2 and Aergrind get the brewing gigs these days.

tompoland

Just dropped the idea of getting the Mazzer Omega hand grinder when I saw a Helor 106 with Mazzer 71mm conical burrs. Managed to score one near new (1kg through it, according to the owner) from Canada. It will take a couple of weeks to get to Australia but I’ll let you know what I think once it’s here and I’ve had a play.

https://www.helor.com/product/helor-106-hand-coffee-grinder/

I still think the Mazzer Omega is the bees knees, just couldn’t help myself in regard to the trying the Helor.

I don’t have a C40 or JX but i can compare the Helor to the Kinu M47 Classic. What may be of interest also (for me at least) is comparing back to back shot with the 63mm Mazzers in the Niche, the 71mm Mazzers in the Helor and the 83mm Mazzers in the Malwani Livi.

I’ll bet dollars to donuts I won’t be able to tell the difference 🙃 - any takers?

(To be clear, I’m talking US dollars and French donuts)

LMSC

tompoland

Lance did one a few days ago.

He also did manual grinders review. It is too and haven’t watched it yet.

DavecUK

tompoland I’ll bet dollars to donuts I won’t be able to tell the difference 🙃 - any takers?

I think you would be hard pushed to tell any difference, although the larger burrset will make a small difference due to the larger grinding area.

tompoland

DavecUK indeed, that’s what I was suggesting; that I won’t be able to tell the difference. Maybe between the 63mm and 83mm … maybe. But it would have to be a blind test.

Stevebee

I’ve had the Helor 106 for a year or so now and it’s a great solid grinder. Much prefer the flavour profile for filter to that of the Niche but that could be down to burr rpm not size. Niche at 330 v 20 on the Helor. Tastes a cleaner cup. Not as much difference compared to the Comandante tbh.

I’m just carrying out the mod to use 83mm conical in the Helor. These are the Mazzer burrs not the Italmill ones in the Malwani. I’ve done a revised design compare to the one I saw on YouTube as his files only have 9 magnets, mine has 12 on the cup, plus did not like how the outer burr attaches. I’ve inserted an embedded hex nut in the print so it’s solid and secure. Version 2 will use an embedded square nut as this will resist twisting even more although the hex shows no sign of an issue.

Should be interesting to taste 83mm conical running at really low rpms - I know the marketing blurb for the Weber Key sells it lower rpm as a positive - we’ll see

CoyoteOldMan

Not quite adding to the comparisons, but… any recommendations for a manual grinder that can do Turkish and espresso (no worries about filter)?

On the one hand, I’m tempted to spend £50 on a Sözen, and use that for my Turkish addiction; on the other, having a nice hand grinder to do one-off/true single dose with different beans will allow us to use the Ceado more ‘as it is meant to be used’ and dial it in precisely for the “house espresso”. Suddenly £300 for an Omega/Kinu/Comandante aren’t as preposterous…

MWJB

CoyoteOldMan Sozen certainly do fine Turkish grind, but be aware they’re pretty agricultural, a fair bit of variation from one to another in terms of finish. Setting can drift with use too. Plus the brass smell can be hard for some to get past.

What about a Feldgrind/Aergrind? (Might take a bit longer to grind).

CoyoteOldMan

MWJB Will add the Feldgrind/Aergrind to the list of possibilities! Thank you for the suggestion, and for the info on Sözen; I suppose one largely gets what one pays for…

Norvin

CoyoteOldMan

Don’t forget the Aerspeed. It has more aggressive burrs than the Aergrind so takes less time to grind, you can really feel it chomping through the beans. The trade off is that it has less adjustment for espresso but is still capable. I bought mine as I was fed up with the time taken to grind for the Aeroperess when camping with a Rhinowares, I chose it over the Aergrind and I’m still happy with that choice.

Stevebee

A couple of photos showing the mod to change the Helor 106 to 83mm Mazzer burrs. Totally reversible in a couple of minutes. Takes 45 seconds to dial in 21g for a Decent lever profile which needs a fine grind. Similar effort to the 71mm burrs. I think I grind at around 120 rpm which means the burrs are grinding at 30 rpm. Does increase the weight to 6g short of 2 kg but the body is narrower than say a Commandante so is comfortable to hold whilst grinding. Same burr set as the Weber Key, without the coating, I’m a 2.0 on the dial for espresso. My first attempt was at 1.1 - 90 seconds and not even a drip out and took an age to grind, way too fine. Compare to a Pharos it’s a joy to turn.

Looking forward to trying for pourover now as will be interesting to see any flavour difference between my Niche or Compak E10

tompoland

Stevebee How are the 83mm compared to the original 71mm Steve?

I did my first back to back comparisons last weekend (83mm Mazzer Robur in the Malwani versus 71mm Mazzer Robur in the Helor) and to me they tasted so similar that I’m certain that I would not be able to pick the difference in a blind taste test.

CoyoteOldMan

Quick (non-)update. Got an unexpected small job paying just enough to cover an Omega. So, guess what is awaiting for me with a friend in Italy? (Cheaper and easier to pay for 22% Italian VAT and courier than risking shipping to the UK with random duties applied…)

DavecUK

CoyoteOldMan Be interested to hear what you think. I saw one at the show and it looked very good.

CoyoteOldMan

DavecUK Will do a mini-review once the grinder is in the UK in early August - we will be using it as a ‘travel grinder’ during our vacation too (but not for espresso - moka and Turkish only; I’m not travelling with the Leva!)

Stevebee

I never used it much recently with the 71mm burrs as I tend to use the 98 flats in the Ultra for espresso. Used it more recently with the 83mm but not back to back like you so difficult to say. Do prefer it to the Niche as it seems to produce a clearer cup at filter grind. Might be grind speed rather than burr size tbh but haven’t done enough testing

tompoland

Stevebee the extra clarity (over the Niche) is more likely due to burr geometry than RPM. Niche has Mazzer Kony and the other burrs are both Mazzer Robur.

Knluk

Good read on all the discussion here. I own a Jx Pro and this is my first espresso related. I am thinking about upgrade. I have zero experience in electric grinder but I love the simplicity of Jx Pro in term of its low retention and low maintenance and ease of cleaning. So my next upgrade may likely be a hand grind. It seems that the Omega will not offer very significant improvement in cup compared to the JX Pro.

Has any of you looked at the HG-1 Prime? I just heard about this grinder. I was surprised that it costs “only” a portion of the HG-2 with comparable spec. And it seems the HG-1 and HG-2 are in the elite league of hand grinder. Would love to hear your thought on it. Thanks.

tompoland

Knluk I looked at the HG1 and 2 but ended up going with a Malwani Livi fitted with Mazzer Robur (same as Key grinders). I like the Livi’s three gears and the style.

Have to say I really like the look of the Prime but it came out after I ordered the Livi. I suspect you will notice a difference if you upgrade. But other than the reduced grind time the difference won’t be huge but IMHO still very worthwhile.

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