I pre-ordered the 63mm conical variant of these from https://gorillagear.coffee/products/gorilla-gear-roblack-burrs-71mm-conical?_pos=1&_sid=de7841d97&_ss=r&variant=40171553259608 which are made to fit the Niche Zero and other grinders that use the Mazzer Kony burrs that the Niche uses. Made by John Gordon in New Zealand and now supplying the likes of high end grinder manufacturer Titus. [URL=https://i.imgur.com/Yzh1dWi.jpg][IMG]https://i.imgur.com/Yzh1dWi.jpg[/IMG][/URL] The burrs arrived late last week and I've just had my first three pours after putting a kilo of beans through for seasoning followed by a couple of sinkers while I sorted the grind size out. I'm impressed. From a Kenya AA bean medium/dark I detected more origin flavors than with the original burrs. The difference is more distinct than I dared hope for. The trade off is the very small loss of viscosity. Bear in mind that this is not a side by side comparison because I don't have two Niche grinders. But when my sons Niche arrives in a few weeks I'll ask him to bring it with him and run some side by sides with some Medium and Medium Light beans and will report back. The jury is out until then. Interested to know if anyone else has tried GG burrs.

Looking forward to a side by side comparison from you, I think it will be interesting and I'm sure more people will look at buying the burrs when they are more readily available. But for the price I guess people will have to see how well they work so I'm glad someone can do some testing for us

@"tompoland"#p34172 I'll be interested in the results Tom.

Appreciate its too early to say, Tom , but interested indeed your experience of these in a niche (which i have) vs olympia moca sd (whch i might buy…) Would be a lot cheaper to buy new burrs! Thanks

Very promising! Look forward to hearing about the results, conscious these will be primarily for espresso but any pour over comparisons would also be appreciated as I know people gave the Niche a hard time for the fines it created especially on lighter roasts.

I also ordered the Gorilla burrs. WEEKS ago! After numerous delays and extremely poor communication from Gorilla I'm expecting delivery tomorrow. So a week or so I'll have drawn some conclusions. I'm very interested to know your thoughts, @"tompoland"#121 !

@"tompoland"#121 Thanks for offering to complete the side by side tests, Tom. And looking forward to learning of your impressions, @"Grahamsphillips"#p34213 And anyone else.

@"TomR"#p34196 Tom I have poured a few shots from each grinder over the last two days, simply for when I have an espresso each morning. Bearing in mind that means an hour or two in between each grind so it's not a side by side comparison which I find is the best method for taste comparisons. So take this with a pinch of salt but at this stage it's a surprisingly close call to between them. I don't know what miracles John Gordon has worked with his GG conical burrs, but they are mighty impressive. As you know, I'm still to do side by side comparisons with another Niche so I'll add side by side comparisons with the Moca SD to the queue. Thanks for the idea, not sure why I didn't think of it. In the interests of setting a realistic time frame expectation, the Niche GG burrs to Niche Kony burrs comparison is still a few weeks away because I need to wait for my son's Niche to arrive (ETA two weeks) and then for him to come for a visit. But it will happen. For the Niche GG burrs to Moca SD, I can do that early next week when the beans I have resting are ready to go. I'll post back here.

> @"FadedFrontiers"#p34202 any pour over comparisons would also be appreciated sorry FF but I can't help you with that, I have not the faintest idea how to do a pour over or even what it should taste like. I could do something with the Gevi 4-1 that is collecting dust at the moment but to be quite honest, I'm the last person you should listen to on pour over. re pour over: @"lancehedrick"#742 are you in the building? You gotta gotta gotta try the John Gordon burrs.

Hi @"tompoland"#121 I believe @"lancehedrick"#742 is indeed expecting some of the GG burrs so it’ll be interesting to see his take esp as he’s not a fan of the NICHE with the stock burrs

@"Grahamsphillips"#p34236 good to know thanks GP. From memory (not always a good idea) Lance's main point in his "one year on" review was that the NZ was not the all rounder be-all-and-end-all grinder that some were making it out to be. The Kony burrs in the NZ are certainly proven performers for medium-dark and dark roasts. And when people add milk to those type of beans, they excell even more. But yes, it will be interesting to see his review. I'm loving the GG burrs but their arrival coincided with a new batch of beans so the beans may be a part of the difference I'm tasting. So I'm looking forward to getting a second NZ to run the side by side comparison with the same beans.

Gorilla Gear burrs in a Niche Zero

Grahamsphillips

Yes it’s actually better with the disk in place because it slows the flow of beans towards the burrs. In the end the best compromise is to add a few grams of beans. Grind. Lift the lid. Add a few more grams. And so on.

Grahamsphillips

DavecUK that chokes the grinder. I’m worried about damaging the motor

washed

Seems like you’ve done your due diligence here and gave them a shot. I would refund them.

As I have a 3d printer the first thought that came to mind was a dual layer disc to further restrict the bean flow (would require a longer bolt). But going to such lengths to accommodate a set of burrs would be among the sillier things I’ve thought of.

tompoland

Personally I won’t return them just yet because I’m enjoying the flavour profile and John Gordon is developing a “cone” as he calls it (no idea what that is @Grahamsphillips may be able to enlighten us) which he’s going to send to anyone who wants it I believe without charge, and he has hopes that will fix the problem.

He’s also offering immediate and full refunds for those who want one or later if the cone doesn’t fix the issue. Can’t be fairer than that.

This information was gleaned from the email chain between Graham and John, which the former was kind enough to copy me on, and it also revealed that John intended these burrs to be fitted inside a Mazzer Kony commercial
grinder which has a more powerful motor. That may explain why the Niche is struggling.

JHCCoffee

tompoland tompoland

I’ve been following this thread and have to thank you both (and others) for your diligence and patience and your sharing of this process with us. Moreover it’s fantastic that you are prepared to and work with GG, to give John the time he needs to improve his product and (hopefully) make it work, to the benefit of all. And kudos to John for being honest, upfront and willing to fully refund anyone who is not happy.

I fully agree with @DavecUK that this kind of respectful conversation works so much better (for the greater good) than the kind of harsh condemnation that I’ve seen from social media influencers and on some other forums. One sensational video may create more ad revenue for an Influencer but can be ruinous for an honest manufacturer trying to improve and address issues with a decent product.

Grahamsphillips

My thoughts exactly. Let’s give John a bit more time to solve the problem

Gagaryn

DavecUK Possibly too cheap, for the same reason that you would be daft to use a £10 multimeter to measure current at mains voltages. I’m not sure I’d want to use something that cheap that is potentially measuring 13 amps of current at 240v. The £12 one I linked to in another thread is actually well put together with proper protection circuitry.

ajohn

tompoland However the GG burrs will simply clog the grinder for any beans lighter than Medium.

A question. The grinder chokes. Does this mean that grinds stop coming out or that the motor stalls ie slows down dramatically or stops rotating at all?

Grahamsphillips

ajohn Both! It can slow down then speed up again but mostly it stopped completely and obvs I don’t want to risk the motor burning out

tompoland

I’ll defer to @Grahamsphillips on that because he’s got more expensive with choking the Niche, poor guy.

I can at least confirm that the grinds stop coming out. As soon as I saw that I flipped the switch fast.

Tjyven

tompoland “Personally, I think John Gordon is on to something pretty big with these burrs. He’s also done a 71mm version and I’d be very tempted to try those too.”

Will these fit in your Helor 106?

tompoland

Tjyven I would think so. Thing is though, I only use the Helor for a maximum of a couple of dozen grinds a year when travelling so it’s really not worth AU$450 (£260-ish) odd to try them.

JonWoo187

Tjyven Actually this guy has done that burr swap and seems to work fine for his use…

https://www.home-barista.com/grinders/helor-flux-helor-106-review-after-6-months-ownership-t70092-10.html

washed

If I had one complaint about these over the few weeks, it’s that the good shot window is pretty small compared to the mazzers, and making a mistake in dialing toward a bit too fine means the grinder might stall.

I just came back from traveling and bought some nice beans, it stalled twice on these naturals so I just put the mazzers back in and got in a good range on the first try. 🤣

tompoland

Agree it’s a very real problem. And a deal breaker for me.

I need to be able to grind beans lighter than medium roast. The issue appears to be the Niche’s domestic motor versus say the Mazzer Kony’s commercial motor. Or its the chute design in conjunction with the motor.

Either way, I’ll wait for the fix and cross fingers.

@washed which espresso machine are you using it with?

washed

tompoland

ajohn

tompoland The issue appears to be the Niche’s domestic motor versus say the Mazzer Kony’s commercial motor. Or its the chute design in conjunction with the motor.

You could open up the size of the exit from the grinds chamber to allow a faster flow out but that might cause chute problems.

A more powerful motor and gearbox could probably be fitted to Niche with the same shaft size but if the relay had to be upgraded as well that might be more of a problem. The gear box may be able to take more power. a significantly more powerful motor with the same shaft size - pass. They may well be all standard parts rather than specials.

DavecUK

tompoland I need to be able to grind beans lighter than medium roast. The issue appears to be the Niche’s domestic motor versus say the Mazzer Kony’s commercial motor. Or its the chute design in conjunction with the motor.

To be absolutely correct Tom, there is no issue with the Niche motor, or it’s power. It was designed to never stall on those (very well designed Kony Burrs). The issue appears to be the Gorilla Gear burrs and their design 😉

I realise it’s a small point…..but looking at it from outside in……. 😁

tompoland

washed thanks. Asking about the type of espresso machine though 🙂

washed

tompoland Oops. I replied while waiting for my sushi and read it wrong 😂.

Gaggia Classic with full, up-to-date Gaggiuino mod.

Cuprajake

At this point I’d say add the £500 from the niche to the £350-400 the burrs cost and buy something else

Chopping up a niche. There’s not alot of room inside,

Or buy a kony

I get it’s nice to try burrs I’ve done it,

ajohn

Cuprajake I get it’s nice to try burrs I’ve done it,

LOL I was think don’t hold your breath on a solution. Might be interesting to try the stainless ones. I’m put off by the need for a running in period. These are said to give a different taste by a person who I believe drinks medium roast and little else but not sure.

Me, having used the grinds cup on NIche for a long time I’ve switched to directly into the portafilter. 😀 It’s proving interesting and some surprising changes.

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