Christmas Coffee Stuff

Elcarajillo Usually the answer is, “You are the first person ever to complain of this”.

In fact, for so many things I am the “first person ever”, “the only person” etc.. I should do the lottery. Even with a well known fault with a car years ago, which everyone has “I was the only person evahh….”

Well, no reply from Lucy……time to ramp it up!

@dfk41 You may want to give them a call. It may help.

DavecUK
I was the only person ever to complain to a local Costa that their teapots were filthy. I went in before Christmas and had a mint tea (obviously avoided the coffee), which was served to me in a teapot with a disgustingly dirty spout. First I was told that no-one else had complained, then that it was just stained-at which point I put my little finger in the spout to prove it was definitely dirt- and then when I politely asked to speak to the manager she said that Costa aren’t allowed to clean the spouts of their teapots, which is apparently a corporate decision. Words utterly fail me. I was served another mint tea in a glass by way of compensation. No apology at any point.

Well one year after dfk41 was given some bags of Ueshima beans from his nephew for Christmas, guess what I got from my son-in-law for Christmas 2022? A bag of their House Blend beans bought in mid-December 2022 from The Japan Centre.

And also they only had an unnamed date on the back, which I presume is their ‘Best before’ date -
The beans smelt very good when I opened the bag and looked like this - Quite a dark roast but not oily. They tasted good to me as espresso. What might be described as like a traditional Italian espresso, but with no bitterness.

I was similarly curious as to how old the beans were and emailed Ueshima to ask. I got the same bland PR reply twice. On my third and last try, when I said that members of a coffee enthusiasts’ forum in the UK were looking forward to hearing their reply, I got -

Many thanks for your comments below, all feedback is important and I have passed this to our marketing team to help going forward with regards to the roasting date and information provided on the packaging.

The best before date is now 18 months from the roast date. The gas flashing keeps the coffee fresher for

longer.

I think that 18 months back from 19 April 2024 is 19 October 2022. So the beans were two months old when bought from the retailer. I had expected older. I bought a tin of Illy Classico beans from Sainsbury’s in December 2022 because a restaurant we went to used them and their espresso was remarkably good. The beans in the tin (a blend of nine different beans and described as ‘Medium roast’), were of different sizes and some broken and did not look or smell very good, especially at £6.50 for 250g.

Unlike Ueshima, Illy print exact roast dates on the bottom of the tin, which to be fair was sealed with a ring pull lid and this was on my tin -

So they were about 5 months old.

Well I don’t know what to make of all this. Ueshima ‘House Blend’ as a medium-dark blend, readily available in Sainsbury’s & Waitrose at £4.25 for 250g and £8 for 500g (a useful size bag, I think) were to my liking and of high quality. They say they have been in business since 1933 and are No.1 for coffee in Japan.
The beans are ‘made’ in Netherlands for Europe distribution.

Their unhelpful sourcing blurb reads:
Our House Blend coffee beans have been responsibly sourced from across the bean belt, the geographical area that sits between the two topics of Cancer and Capricorn. We have created blends - which will remain secret to preserve the work of our Japanese coffee masters - from our longstanding relationships with coffee farmers and cooperatives across different countries.

I would be interested in others’ views about the Ueshima House Blend beans.

Never a fan of roasters who don’t put a roast date on their bags.

But to be fair, the great unwashed masses who buy from a supermarket probably don’t know or don’t care that beans have a reasonably short “best by” date. Most punters will grind and enjoy with milk and probably wonder why some bags of beans deliver more flavor that others.

Many forum fanatics have partners who say “yeah yeah, I hear what you are saying about freshness and grinding and temperature but can’t you just pour me my Nespresso cos that’s what I like the most” and “what I like the most” is hard to argue with.

Horses for courses is what I’m saying: no roast date is a big turn off for me but most probably don’t care.

Your bag of beans was two month old are look like a medium/dark roast so there were very likely past their peak but it sounds like they were still pretty tasty. Probably not for much longer though.

i hate getting beans for xmas there usually always from a google search and best before,

i have some now which are filter, and another which is a med/dark but im so fine on grind to get them through the leva haha

MediumRoastSteam jrling Our House Blend coffee beans have been responsibly sourced from across the bean belt, the geographical area that sits between the two topics of Cancer and Capricorn

That’s an amazing response I have to say…. What was yours I wonder…? “No sheet Sherlock?” 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤌🤌🤌🤌🤌🤌

“I couldn’t possibly comment……” Actually I really couldn’t, as those words were copied from their website

jrling as those words were copied from their website

Yeah, I figured that out. 😀 - In any case, I think we should get back on tropic. (sorry, couldn’t resist!) 🤣

tompoland Never a fan of roasters who don’t put a roast date on their bags.

But to be fair, the great unwashed masses who buy from a supermarket probably don’t know or don’t care that beans have a reasonably short “best by” date. Most punters will grind and enjoy with milk and probably wonder why some bags of beans deliver more flavor that others.

Many forum fanatics have partners who say “yeah yeah, I hear what you are saying about freshness and grinding and temperature but can’t you just pour me my Nespresso cos that’s what I like the most” and “what I like the most” is hard to argue with.

Horses for courses is what I’m saying: no roast date is a big turn off for me but most probably don’t care.

Your bag of beans was two month old are look like a medium/dark roast so there were very likely past their peak but it sounds like they were still pretty tasty. Probably not for much longer though.

I agree. It is plain stupid not to show roast batch date, although it is not a legal requirement in UK.

The Ueshima beans were a present from my Japanese son-in-law. I had an open mind on them and had a surprisingly pleasant experience with them.

One question that does arise more generally relates to nitrogen gas flushing. Many bean roasters quote that process as keeping their beans fresh. So does that process achieve its objective?

Nitrogen is an inert gas. If it is under pressure in the bag, it would reduce the CO2 ‘degassing’ from the beans and subsequent exposure of the beans to oxygen, which I understand is responsible for the staleness after roasting.

The process of nitrogen flushing involves filling each bag with grounds or beans and feeding the filled bags into a dispenser that flushes and seals the bag at once.

Most freshly roasted beans are best for brewing 2 weeks after roasting, when the CO2 emissions have stabilised. Nitrogen flushing is said to extend that ideal brewing time by up to a further 8 weeks.

So my nitrogen flushed Ueshima beans which were about 8 weeks old when I opened the pack, could be still in the ‘fresh’ period. They certainly smelt that way. But for Ueshima to claim a 12 month freshness through nitrogen flushing is implausible.

I would guess, that a large part of their customer base have a Japanese connection. My nephew is married to a Japanese girl, and although he drinks a French Press knows nothing about coffee and buys pre ground from them. He was crestfallen when I explained to him that the coffee was not Japanese (I do not think Japan grows coffee) and that in effect they were simply playing the marketing game. To be selling beans at their prices, it is Commodity coffee which will not come with high expectations

Actually, rather to my surprise, I have checked and there is coffee grown in southern Japan, which is in the subtropics. But not a lot.

I suspect that if you had an Italian, French or Dutch nephew, they would also be crestfallen to learn that their beloved espresso was not made from beans grown in their country too!

Those countries (and any not situated in the tropics) and including UK, could also be accused of ‘playing the marketing game’. Surely they are all buying green beans on the wholesale markets, roasting them, packing them and putting a mark-up on their total cost? I don’t see anything wrong in that actually. That’s business.

What surprises me is the great disparity in the retail price of speciality roasters product, which can be very marked and IMHO not always justified for the highest prices, even for SO from the main producing countries and certainly not for blended product. I guess some are playing the marketing game and one is paying handsomely for their beautifully designed packaging. Actually, to come full circle, the Ueshima packs are beautifully designed!

jrling I suspect that if you had an Italian, French or Dutch nephew, they would also be crestfallen to learn that their beloved espresso was not made from beans grown in their country too!

Can’t speak for the French or Dutch, but Italians are pretty aware that coffee is only roasted in Italy, and it comes from other countries. If you asked them “which ones?”…. you may or may not get an answer, never mind a correct one. 😉

I would only add that local roasting is not just “marketing”; it’s pretty much a necessity considering the shelf-life of green vs. roasted beans.