https://youtu.be/Cp9nQdlCwmM?list=TLGGCNfd9PERLfIwNTA0MjAyMw Pre-order on Bella Barista for £50 cheaper than a Lelit Bianca.

Seems they are finally allowed to post about it…I did an Engineering review for ECM, been using it for the last 2 or 3 months. A very enjoyable machine to use with interesting features. The video is sadly as interesting as watching paint dry, the same with the initial manual I have seen. Here's what you **really** need to know: * Forget all those difficult remember functions, I have mine on a smart plug and so will you * You will likely never use, or want to use it in HX mode with all the flushing etc.. * You will almost certainly use it in BC2 mode all the time This is why I believe it's a great machine, and this is nothing to do with the specifications)s you can read those yourself and we know ECM is a quality company. * The machine has a smaller footprint than a dual boiler * There is internal simplicity with only 1 boiler (albeit 2 temperature sensors (on in the HX loop and one in the main boiler. 1 heating element and none of the extra stuff that goes hand in hand with having 2 boilers. * It's really simple to use once you have it set up correctly * It has a number of advantages over a dual boiler system (I will go into this later and you can decide if those advantages apply to you) * The same or saves energy in comparison to dual boiler machines * SCACE testing showed temps are good (with a little adjustment to the offset on my pre production version Typically I go up to the machine (it's set to the brew temp I like for my current roasts). I can change it if I want and the machine will show the new desired temp when it's ready. I grind tamp and warm the cup (**from the hot water tap)** just before the shot, lock and load and pull the shot…no flushing required. Excellent as I don't have to worry that my dual boiler machine doesn't have the steam boiler on. Or I lock and load, then think, I want a latte…so I get out the latte cup, warm it with a little hot water…grab the milk from the fridge and when I pull the shot, tap the down button. As the shot is going, I can purge the want a little and by the time the shot has finished (or even before), I'm steaming. If I walk away within 3 minutes the steam boost stops and everything goes back to normal. **Or, I can press and hold the down button, screen goes black with a . then I press the down button again and steam mode is cancelled.** This totally minimises overheat recovery time. If you also use a little hot water from the tap to rinse things off for clean up, recovery time back to brewing temps is massively reduced. You soon get into a nice esy routine, without giving it a second thought. In a way it's better than a dual boiler for most people…never thought I would be saying that. You have the energy saving, as warming up a big steam boiler takes a lot of energy, which then goes to waste. You have to wait 5-7 minutes for it to be ready for steaming. Sure you can say, well I have temperature stability, but you do with the ECM system. All the advantages of good brew temperature control with all the extra benefits. I actually love using the ECM barista Max…a friend came over today and I did him and americano and decided I would have a latte, and when he saw how I used it, he said "yeah, I totally get it". ***BC2 is it's strength and I have suggested that all Bella Barista machines come that way and not set up as HX by default.***

@"DavecUK"#p41503 - good to know thanks! But… which one is better? This one or the MaraX? 😉 Also… https://i.imgur.com/j4okguO.jpg At a guess… was that it?

Big price difference between those 2 - does it have any major different features / selling points ?

@"MediumRoastSteam"#p41513 It was….

ECM Mechanika Max - MaraX on steroids?

DavecUK

MediumRoastSteam It was….

MediumRoastSteam

I’m really sorry. But I read and re-read… functionality wise, how is it different from the MaraX?

DavecUK

MediumRoastSteam It’s an entirely different machine to use, you can set the actual brew temp. It’s like a dual boiler but with advantages a DB doesn’t have in the right use situation.

If I see you soon enough it might well still be on the counter. Then you can try it. I should try and make a vid as well.

It’s become a firm favourite with me.

MediumRoastSteam

DavecUK you can set the actual brew temp

Appreciate you can do this via a digital display, but I thought that, on the MaraX, you can do the same through a 3 way button switch?

Also, is he construction all stainless steel like the Lelit machines? I was under the impression ECM/Profitec use a powder coated steel frame on their machine. I think my Profitec was like that, but maybe things have changed.

Cuprajake

Think it looks nicer than a mara

mobius

So it’s like the next step up from the Classika PID for people who need more (frequent) steam ?

I only drink espresso, so the Classika PID was perfect for me, but I can see how anyone steaming milk may want something a bit more, but not necessarily ‘high-end’.

MediumRoastSteam

mobius - it’s a clever HX machine, similar to the MaraX, that’s all. THe Classika is a SBDU, so a totally different class of machine. If you mainly drink espresso without milk, I’d keep your Classika. No point having a machine with a bigger boiler operating at steaming temperatures if you can have one operating at coffee brewing temperatures.

DavecUK

MediumRoastSteam it’s a clever HX machine, similar to the MaraX, that’s all.

It’s actually a lot more than that….I will do a short video when I get time. One that actually explains the key things anyone considering it really needs to know. From that awful video just going through the features, what the machine actually is, doesn’t shine through.

MediumRoastSteam

DavecUK - I see. Thank you. Yes, that video is soooo boring.it’s voiced by the guy from WLL, Todd?, I think, and I tell you, I had to watch most of it on mute as I can’t stand his voice! 🤣🤣🤣🤣

I’d be interested to know where and how exactly it is superior, in terms of delivering water at a constant temperature in the cup, to the MaraX. Maybe the software is more clever and capable at taming the temperatures more precisely? Or is there something else other than a probe on the HX which monitors temp?

DavecUK

MediumRoastSteam Until I make the video, think of it as a dual boiler of sorts. A small brew boiler surrounded by a much larger heated boiler that passively heats it and maintains it at the brew temp you set.

Then it might start to make more sense.

MattH

DavecUK So like the linea micra in that respect then ? Tiny brew boiler with the larger steam one ?

DavecUK

MattH So like the linea micra in that respect then ? Tiny brew boiler with the larger steam one ?

sort of but the ECM max is an HX machine, it just functions like a dual boiler with one little boiler inside a bigger one as a simile.

The fact is for many people it would make more sense than a dual boiler… remembering that with dual boilers unless you want to use more energy and bake the insides, usually we turn the steam boiler off when not required. So you get all of the dual boiler advantages:

excellent temp control
good steaming

and in addition some advantages a dual boiler doesn’t give you

always steam ready, but not steam hot to be always steam ready
If a dual boilers steam boiler is off, you have a 10 minute wait, not with this, ever
hot water from the tap always
lower or same energy consumption (as you never have to warm a big service boiler from cold and then wastefully let it cool down again
small footprint
simpler internals, less points of failure
Little tricks you can do to enhance operation further
Lower max power consumption

Where the design absolutely makes sense is for the prosumer as most use patterns absolutely fit it’s functions. I do genuinely love using it,

MediumRoastSteam

DavecUK - I can’t wait for this video. It seems like a very interesting machine, where ECM (finally) gave it a lot of thought to it!

MattH

DavecUK So does it get to temp quicker than a dual boiler ? - Would it be ask quick as the micra.

I am looking for a small footprint and quickness to temp, ease of use and consistency 😂 sounds like I need to look at this as well as the more expensive micra

DavecUK

MattH So does it get to temp quicker than a dual boiler ? - Would it be ask quick as the micra.

I am looking for a small footprint and quickness to temp, ease of use and consistency 😂 sounds like I need to look at this as well as the more expensive micra

They do an overheat routine to make it ready faster…it tells you when it’s ready, which is about 20 minutes. I don’t know how quick the Micra really is?

MediumRoastSteam

Interesting they didn’t bother fitting a flow control valve out of the box as they are now doing for the Profitec 700 / ECM Synchronika. (I think they are? Or maybe I’m going crazy)

Radecki82

Very helpful topic for potential future owners of Mechanika MAX.

@DavecUK any chance to make a video with in-depth review this month?

DavecUK

Radecki82 I need to make time to do something.

mhwolf

Hi, question about the Max: It has an offset feature for accounting for the thermoprobe in the thermosiphon loop inaccuracy. How does this work? I am seriously considering this machine (in the Seattle area), as I only make espressos.

DavecUK

mhwolf It allows for the same difference in temperature between water in the brew boiler of a dual boiler and the temp when it hits the coffee. The HX being PID controlled effectively acts like a hot water jacketed brew boiler.

The Machine allows you to modify the built in offset by +5/-5C for fine tuning to your specific situation….This whole scenario is active when the machine is one of the BC modes, I keep mine in BC2 all the time.

P.S. The original programming allowed fine tuning of +/- 3C, but I asked them to increase it. This was because the BC1 to BC3 modes increase in aggressiveness of return to brew temperature e.g. capacity to make coffees one after the other. This might mean tuning the setup slightly differently if you have a busier situation.

It is an excellent machine and currently my daily driver. It has the convenience of dual boiler temperature control, with good steam just a button push and 30 or so seconds away.

MediumRoastSteam

mhwolf I am seriously considering this machine (in the Seattle area), as I only make espressos.

Seems counter-intuitive to me to buy an HX machine which operates at steaming temperatures if you only want to make espresso.