Evening looks like the Philios is out in the wild (well to someone on youtube !) Looking forward to the review https://youtube.com/shorts/a0Upq7N2v0E?si=O01ykOp7RBmrD5ff

Excitement builds!! Looking at the architecture it looks like someone in the UK too! I have absolutely zero interest in what the influencers think of this one, it’s a day one purchase for me.

@"HarveyMushman"#p60274 yes he is defo in the Uk - i do like his videos! I have not ordered the gbw allground - kinda waiting to see what the philos is like.. tbh nothing wrong with my current allground….. Still cannot see a price officially on the mazzer site - nor of they will have a reseller in the UK rather than a import from Venice.

I might’ve imagined this but I think @"DavecUK"#1 suggested Mazzer will retail this themselves and aim for a sub £1k price point (possibly for early adopters, with a later price rise). I’ve been waiting years for a single-dose, multi-method grinder from a heritage manufacturer that I like the design of. The latter two usually being the reason for me not buying anything yet. Tbh, even if it’s not perfect it’ll be an upgrade on my current setup and like the LM, just nice to own and use.

Looks great. I think I’ve read somewhere it’s between 900-100 euros.

@"Emc2"#p60303 I wish it was a 100 euros 😂

Quick snap from youtube as he has it on the shelf - and gives some nice size comparisons [URL=https://i.imgur.com/c1yDEj3.jpg][IMG]https://i.imgur.com/c1yDEj3.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

Rumours on HB, so take this with a pinch of salt, are that the Philos has been delayed. Wouldn’t surprise me given the impact global conflicts on supply chains.

Yeah I saw that. Though made me laugh that places took deposits and then refunded especially as I thought that mazzer were selling them direct to start with… but theres no info in the mazzer site either. Just waiting to see the review tbh - anyhow my blind shaker is about to arrive - so something else to play with 😂

Yeah the retailers I've spoken to in the UK said they had no plans to stock it. Looks like it will indeed be Mazzer direct. I can see the reviews being disappointing. There's no shortage of low priced 64mm flats and people who don't care about build quality, place of build and manufacturer heritage are going to say it's overpriced and find plenty of flaws I'm sure. It's an interesting price point because you can get capable single dosers for half the price or less, and it's obviously not going to compete with the top-end grinders like Kafateks etc. I think the only way this will sell well in the current market is if influencers really get behind it. Then again, I don't think Mazzer necessarily need it to sell massively well as the home market still isn't their bread and butter. I'm excited for it and have said before, will be buying it regardless but I don't expect it to be a flawless grinder.

depends really, the build should be better than that of the df and time mores, you would think, but its a saturated market there has been a zerno fs and a kafatec and weber eg1 all around £1500 on the old forum

Mazzer Philos

Cuprajake

agree the pricing on mazzers is all over the place,

i loved my major, and often look for a cheap jolly, just to try 64mm

id much rather that than some of the current 64mm grinders on the market,

FadedFrontiers

MediumRoastSteam why didn’t the Eureka Oro line take off then? Because they are not Mazzers? A single dose Eureka Oro is half the price of this new Mazzer.

Aside from being a hasty copy and paste job, the Oro’s unusual burr size was also a big factor. They underestimated the hype around 64mm burrs at the time and wanted to tie buyers in to their own 65mms.

The big difference right now is that there’s plenty of single dose grinders everywhere, with various burr sizes and competitively priced too. Still they’ve undercut Lagom and Zerno, even if as you say it’s still more expensive than the Duo.

dfk41

I think a more interesting comparison for the Philos would be the T64. Both on demand, both 64mm……the only thing we know for sure about the Philos is that it will not be £750 plus taxes for very long.

chlorox

The philos is a mazzer which carries a value of its own that is still beyond the cachet of a Niche. The mazzer philos has mazzer burrs just like the Niche except that the philos has a burr set that is purpose designed for light roast beans unlike the burrs of the niche duo that was designed for traditonal roasts. The philos is all metal construction and made in Italy unlike the niche that is mostly made of plastic and made in China. At that introductory price, the philos represents significant value for money which IMHO mazzer should retain in order to help drive the price down for the other makers of single dosing grinders. It is also seems to be the consensus there is little apparent improvement in the cup that 83mm can bring over 64mm. Frankly the philos for me at that price is far preferable than the Niche duo.

HarveyMushman

chlorox It is also seems to be the consensus there is little apparent improvement in the cup that 83mm can bring over 64mm.

I’d agree with this from my tastes. I’d go as far as saying I prefer 64mm burrs. Of course there’s a number of other factors and you can’t really judge burrs alone but 64 definitely seems to be a sweet spot.

dfk41

chlorox The philos is all metal construction and made in Italy unlike the niche that is mostly made of plastic and made in China

Being a scientific type chlorox, I would be most interest in some detail on which parts of the Duo are plastic, compared to the same parts on the Philos. I would point out the there have been thousands of Zero/Duo’s sold and as far as I am aware, no reports of plastic failure

Cuprajake

chlorox don’t mean to derail

But the niche isn’t mostly made of plastic

The lid is lexan

The body and top section are metal

Feet are wood

The chute is plastic and the burr carrier backing is plastic.

This isn’t a niche fan boy thing this is a get you facts correct thing.

After that I don’t care but stuff being passed off wrong gets on my tits

The new mazzer and zerno are the only grinders of recent times that have peaked my interest

However I don’t have a grand plus to spend on them, and I’d poss look to the p64 before either.

HarveyMushman

dfk41 Being a scientific type chlorox, I would be most interest in some detail on which parts of the Duo are plastic, compared to the same parts on the Philos.

The entire chassis for starters.

It doesn’t really matter in the home environment I suppose and as you say, Niches rarely (if ever) fail.

I don’t know anything about the costs of manufacturing but what’s interesting to me is whether tooling for moulded plastic at scale is that much cheaper than CNC machined metal. I guess raw material is cheaper.

Either way, metal chassis’ are Mazzer’s bread and butter so it’s probably easier/lower cost to them than other manufacturers.

chlorox

Cuprajake
Thanks for your post and i stand corrected then as I had somehow gotten the idea that the body was made of plastic.

HarveyMushman

For me it’s just nice to see a bit of healthy competition. I was really impressed with the Duo, and even more so the company and their people I spoke to via email. The Niches are probably the only grinder innovations I’ve appreciated in the last 5 years or so. None of the subsequent competitors appealed until the Philos.

Also the Duo didn’t feel ‘cheap’ to me, still a very well made, well designed piece of kit.

JonWoo187

To each their own, but regardless of how either of the Niche grinders do I could never tolerate the design, even if it was free. To take the awesome Mazzer burrs and bastardize them with an oversized b u t t p l u g design is a bit much, but guess it speaks volume about the ‘designer’…

dfk41

JonWoo187 Just as well that you do not make coffee with design then. Do you know who designed it?

JonWoo187

dfk41 Nope and absolutely don’t care as I’d never own one.

Cuprajake

Very wankerish way to look at things,

MediumRoastSteam

JonWoo187 - so why comment if you don’t care, don’t know and are clueless?

JonWoo187

MediumRoastSteam Clueless? Hilarious how some Niche lovers get butthurt over a simple comment.

BrendaninBrooklyn

JonWoo187 and that comment proves MediumRoastSteam’s point.

MediumRoastSteam

JonWoo187 - tell me something constructive about the Niche Duo and how it’s better, or worse, compared to the Philos. So far you didn’t add anything valuable, apart from some cheap and low insults. Last post from me here about this. But I’d be delighted to hear your constructive feedback. 👋

PS: I’m not a Niche lover. If you read this forum I had my fair share of criticism for the Duo. just go and do your homework.

JammyDodger

I’ve just jointed you HarveyMushman in a black Philos with the 200 burrset - I can’t wait! I couldn’t decide between the black or the silver finish. Since my coffee cart is black I figured it would blend in better. I haven’t bought any new coffee stuff for ages, so this is a bit of a treat!

chlorox

According to the HB reviewers, they seem to be saying that the I200d burrs are less clean and precise than the ssp 64mm cast steel burrs but are less sweet if that’s the case then it won’t serve as a substitute for stepping up to 98mm ssp or shuriken or 102mm mizen burrs

BrendaninBrooklyn

chlorox read it again

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