ACS - At World Of Coffee - Copenhagen

selmerfudd My questions

1- How come the safety system only works when the machine is turned on I thought it was a passive system not active?

This may be of use to you .

https://coffeetime.freeflarum.com/d/10/4757

Adrianmsmith

Yes the mod is indeed interesting-Thank you– I am new to the Coffeetime forum, so many of the discussions i have not yet perused .

I also was concerned about the lower pressure attained with the safety system - as well as the overall weight discrepancy on the puck between 9 bar at 54mm and 9 bar at 58mm , well I managed to obtain 11.7 bar with safety ,close enough !

I still want to experiment with the flush lever pre charge and pre infusion , but so far I have not spent much time studying how to best use the flush system - to see what benefits it could yield.

thanks again interesting reading for sure

selmerfudd

First off im not suggesting anyone does the mod, it was more to show you how it works…..

As for pre charge the best way is to set the flush lever so the pump engages as soon as you move the lever.

Make sure you move the lever to the pump on point . Pause until the pump starts

Get used to the speed required to move the lever so the pump stays on and you do not hit pre infusion pressure until the lever is at the bottom.

Why……..

By doing the above you will have very little air in the cylinder, only water.

So what……

This will give maximum pressure as air is easier to compress .

Im not buying in to the need to go past 11 bars . Some people mod to lighter springs to achieve lower start pressures as they want 9 or 10 bars max.

Psi is psi , or bar, at 20mm or 58mm.

Kg dead weight will give lower psi at 58mm and 54mm

selmerfudd

I purchased this very early on. Its No2, originally purchased by Jake. (Dave has No1)

Prior to that i had Evo1 and Vesuvius after realising the ECM Synchronika was not the holy grail!!

Jakes, my coffee journey would be a good read when you have time ….

https://coffeetime.freeflarum.com/d/572-my-coffee-journey/691

@selmerfudd

……

There you go .

Alternatively You can easily achieve any start pressure you want by putting very slight pressure on the lever after it settles.

@DavecUK Just for you, you will see the standard ACS flush lever arm is fitted 😎

Adrianmsmith

I had reached out to Jake on youtube, prior to ordering my Leva II - he mentioned selling his machine early on due to issues! I also know that dealers are not enamored with ACS and not interested in their machines , i.e. Chris’ Coffee not wanting to bring in the Leva . My friend in Canada advised that the ACS dealer there dropped ACS for quality issues.

I might be out to lunch but it seems to me that somehow much of ( not all of course ) espresso is still in “cottage industry phase” with smallish builders with limited budgets developing and building machines. This drives costs up significantly , resulting in machines costing twice that of a full fledged fridge as example, not to mention the less than rigorous testing and quality control required for a consumer commodity product these days. Whether Decent or ACS and many others , it seems the real testers are the original buyers as was Jake and others.

I wish this industry had reached the “commodity stage” , with more realistic pricing, as are many appliances like the price of today’s microwaves compared to 2 decades ago!

I would like if some LEVA II owners chime in to comment on the consensus of the in cup result of the Leva II VS a DE1 ??

thanks to all who comment

selmerfudd Am I going to be the first to cast doubts on the Decent? OK then, here goes……….you are buying some very clever software paired to a really cheap nasty vibe pump machine. You cannot mend them without sending them half around the world (just as well they do not weigh much). If Decent go out of business then you are stuffed (remembering the Decent is a failed crowdfunding machine to begin with). How many coffee afficianados really want to conduct a laboratory experiment every time they make a coffee. Yes, I hear howls of derision from all the Decent owners who feel they have the ultimate bit of kit (yes I agree, it is ridiculously overpriced). Bring it on!

PS I am a Leva 1 owner not a 2, so please feel free to disregard my rant

dfk41

Oh I am not a Decent fanatic so im not promoting them in any way

selmerfudd

@dfk41

@selmerfudd as your aware i have no axe to grind , im and end user, enthusiast, engineer and coffee lover.

Im nothing to do with the industry or acs.

I started speaking to Jake when he was having issues with the machine.

I had no intention at that time to buy another machine as i already had synchronika, vesuvius and evo 1 in the kitchen, much to my wifes despair!

I subsequently sold the synchronika so was down to (just) 2 machines, both far superior to the ecm which i had previously “liked”. Mine was the limited edition anniversary edition.

The build quality, engineering and tech behind the ACS is better than the ECM

ECM are a relatively massive company more akin to the appliance maufactureres you speak about.

Not all companies are going to grow to that size .

Many specialist “small companies” exist in many fields, not just coffee machines.

Look at the Kafatek video Jake linked and hopefully you will see why they are more expensive than a mass produced model from china . Out of my price range much as I would love to try one.

Due to the size and man power needed prices are not going to be low, except ACS keep prices liw by selling direct. What price would that machine be if it were in a retail shop.

i would suggest as a minimum +50%

To what gain? Happy retailers mainly .

Im sure Jake will contribute here if he disagrees with anything I say but I visited him to view the Evo2 and obviously we shook hands and i now have the machine. Many things contributed to why he was not happy with the machine but I was happy also to purchase from him.

Nothing was hidden as most of the internet knew some part of the issues 😜😎

We had a good chat and Jake was happy to make space for the arrival of a Decent machine to take its place.

Whilst the Decent concept intrigues me , im currently still more of a tactile,valves and buttons kind if guy.

The Evo2 has a good mix of control gear linked to traditional mechanics.

Now if David, @“dfk41” lived a hundred miles closer we could have compared the Mk1 and mk2 to satisfy his curiosity. I did than anyway as i had the Mk1 Mk2 and Vesuvius in the Kitchen .

Now if anyone says the Mk2 is superior IN THE CUP in any way then they are simply trying to delude themselves about the cash they have spent. Most likely they “upgraded” for all the wrong reasons.

The “Upgrade” is not about that.

The “Upgrade ” is all about convenience mainly due to the auto dump feature .

I would hope the guy who purchased my mk1 will enjoy it for a few years.

Im more than happy with the upgrade as it follows my way if thinking.

But, the coffee in the cup is just as good .

The most controversial , if thats the right word, feature is indeed the totally unnecessary so called safety system I’ve been resisting playing with until now. Id always planned on drilling the second hole but was in no hurry to do so other than i was intrigued if it would make any difference

Ive said previously and still believe the system is not required for any safety reason, but im still interested to explore what it can do . Just because i can! Would maybe have done it 3 months earlier if id not broke my tibial plateau.

So the obvious facts.

Due to the restricted input which is by virtue of the need for massive damping should the portafilter be hit with a passing elephant and knocking it off whilst under pressure (sorry but it is true!!) the unaided natural max pressure is 10.5 bars.

This means if you are auto dumping by pressure, to get the same volume in the cup you need to lower your dump pressure by around 0.4 bars compared to using the standard sleeve. Not a real issue as most of the world believe 8 to 9 bars is required at some point in the espresso brewing process.

The system is still capable or shoving 70g of water through a puck, therefore my 46g is perfectly achievable. Video available if you don’t believe me!

Adrianmsmith

"""What price would that machine be if it were in a retail shop. i would suggest as a minimum +50%

To what gain? Happy retailers mainly ."""

You are of course implying a “greedy espresso dealer” that demands a hefty profit margin ( i hate them they are leaches holding the manufacturers for ransom ) - not true of mass marketers Like Lowes or Home Depot in the appliance division , margins there are lower much much lower and competition fierce !

As for safety system , I agree it is not necessary if you are not going to use an auto purge feature, but I wonder if the auto purge might not slap back too hard without the safety I added it to my order simply for the eventual possibility of a quick resale if ever !! - the new buyer will probably require it .

My canada friend has a LaPera , no auto purge no safety , but he swares by it . He downgraded from a La Marzocco Leva which he sold for 50% its original value .

Adrianmsmith

the best grinder I have ever owned and cherished at an affordable price was the Cimbali Junior with hybrid burrs ( DRM burrs )

Taste was out of this world , texture also fantastic , why I sold it for a Weber HG1, I’ll never know !! Would love to find one again !

i could get a Hedon Honne but pricy !