Eiffel

Wouldn’t the LSM CLASS patented damping system make it impossible to ‘force’ the lever to increase pressure by pushing on the lever handle to speed its ascent?

Frankly I am not sure why there seems so much anxiety over the lever handle whipping up. The only way this will happen is if the lever is pulled down on an empty portafilter or no portafilter and then released. The best way to prevent that from happening is to never even touch or pull down on the lever to the cocked position when there is no portafilter loaded or there is nothing in that portafilter. In the past when I owned an izzo the only time when I had to break that rule was when I needed to repeatedly flush the grouphead to raise temperature but I was always conscious of the danger the lever posed because it took real effort to keep pulling it down and then retarding its progress upwards when I flushed it. I sure do not miss that exercise routine nowadays with the nurri whe i can just set the temp I want by using the pid!

  • LMSC replied to this.

      chlorox I know 🤦😃

      Giphy - homer simpson spinning GIF

      Think we’re mixing the conversation, I understand the system, and is use

      But I’ve not seen anyone purpose choke a nurri/Vostok and then vent.

      As @MediumRoastSteam said we’re looking at the mechanism of the leva returning

      As easy you are around the machine doesn’t mean everyone would be, and imagine in a commercial settings where you are mid shot and someone reaches for a cup of the top warmer and hits the paddle, as far fetched as that seems, that’s why they call them accidents.

      Any way let’s move one

      Can we have some more vids please.

      Giphy - star trek data GIF by HULU

      Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

          I don’t know how the LSM CLASS system works, but one could imagine a system similar to the dampers on a car. With these, small amplitude movements can happen at fairly high frequencies/fast, but compressing or releasing fully the shocks takes longer due to the dampening effect of oil going through narrow passages and/or valves.

          It seems to me that the main danger with spring levers coffee machines is that the lever can swing back very quickly if there is nothing to slow it down, such as a coffee puck. Reducing the maximum release rate would reduce the risk of injuries. I would still make for a messy scene with hot water, coffee grounds or even potentially broken cups in some situations

            Cuprajake

            In all the years I have used levers I have only choked my machine once from my recollection. Not yet with the nurri even at nearly max fineness setting on my grinder. So not so easy for me anyway to find myself in that situation!

            In any event, there is no need to actually do that in order to be assured that the lever won’t smack you - because there isn’t any difference between that situation and when we end a shot with the paddle. On fact there would be more water left in the grouphead if the paddle is accidentally triggered at the start of the shot and so the speed of the lever going up should be even slower…

              Eiffel

              U r probably right - it may be some kind of hydraulic based system.

              I reckon the real need for such a system is in the busy cafe where the baristas may not be as experienced on levers or not fully trained and so the shop owner needs to make sure that a moments inattention does not cost them a damaged jaw and/or broken teeth and his shop a lawsuit! But for the home owner of a spring lever who uses his or her machine every day, I think muscle memory and good work habits should make that highly unlikely. Still, it’s a good reminder for all of us lever users to always be mindful around the uppercut machine! :)

                Yeah but it’s good to have the info there for people to see/read for any future buyers

                That’s why I do loads of vids because when I was looking for info on the SSP burrs it was a very closed shop, and very little info about them at the time.

                Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                tompoland t I am hoping that it can be manually triggered because I like the way the Nurri paddle allows me to choose when to end the shot, like on the Slim Jim.

                The Vostock can be manually triggered via the menu selection button beside the display (small steel button). The lever comes up fairly slowly when manually triggered, certainly not fast enough to cause damage. The Nurri would be the same.

                The one thing to watch out for…if the lever is pulled down and while the group is filling the pressure release is activated, then the lever will come up extremely rapidly. It would be impossible to do accidentally on the Vostok. On the Nurri it’s unlikely as well, unless something catches in the left hand paddle, or falls and in some way activates it. So care should be taken to keep that area clear.

                I would also recommend on the Nurri, if the microswitch activation part goes out of alignment at all, you get it immediately fixed so that this can’t happen due to that.

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                    chlorox The only way this will happen is if the lever is pulled down on an empty portafilter or no portafilter and then released. The best way to prevent that from happening is to never even touch or pull down on the lever to the cocked position

                    What are the chances some one pulls the lever down ? Some one accidentally pulling the lever is lower than releasing the lever. Accidents can happen. Perhaps, locking the lever as a safety feature both ways may be the way forward.

                    My first shot with the Evo chocked the lever. I left it to resolve itself. It did as the pressure dripped its’ way through after about 4:30-5:00 mins.

                        LMSC

                        I can only think of the “big stupid brother in law”, most folks have one.
                        You know the type, laughing at your funny coffee machine and lampooning you making a shot by pulling down on the lever, then letting it go while grinning.
                        Might be worth it actually.

                            Amberale

                            I must be fortunwte because no visitor includijg my brother in law has ever even touched my coffee machine or ever even showed any interest in it back when I owned an izzo despite it being a huge lump of stainless steel on my kitchen counter! :)

                              LMSC

                              The effort it takes to pull the lever down may make that of a lower probability than that - it takes someone who really wants to do it in order for it to happen…

                                  chlorox Usually takes about 2 hours on an exhibition day for someone to pull the lever down and then let go, or lock it down then not control it’s rise back….this is on display machines. Stupidity knows no bounds. I may well suggest a locking mechanism on display machines, so the lever can’t be moved.

                                  Or even make a replica rubber lever 😁

                                  Contact me

                                      DavecUK

                                      The left paddle is designed in such a way that makes it a movement that requires a conscious decision to accomplish. It requires more force than a falling cup to pull the left paddle and the weight of the cup isnt enough to do that. Also u need a horizontal force not a downward force which is what a falling cup would exert typically anyway. It also cannot be a momentary force - you have to sustain a higher force than that across a certain horizontal range by continuously pulling the left paddle towards yourself.

                                      I tried knocking the paddle in a downward facing force or a force directed diagonally downwards. The switch didn’t even move. Only a purely horizontal directed force will move the paddle.

                                      Furthermore the pump fills the grouphead quickly, so that would mean almost immediately after the user releases the lever he has to engage the left paddle “accidentally” in order to cause insufficient water to be in the grouohead. But in doing so, the user will more likely also need to move out of line with the lever arm to the left of the group - which puts his chin out of the danger zone.

                                      As for the microswitch alignment part, if it goes out if alignment the left paddle wont even open the valve at all. It is made so that it needs to pull a certain distance before activating the microswitch. That cannot somehow change by itself- unless it is deliberately sabotaged!

                                      Therefore what you suggested is in fact as unlikely to happen as “accidentally” triggering the venting of the grouphead on the vostok by pressing the touch screen wrongly…I use the parentheses because both situations are also to me similarly unlikely to happen and would only be practically possible if one were to intentionally do so…

                                          DavecUK

                                          Perhaps people behave in a more uninhibited fashion in an exhibition area than those who visit the residence of a friend or relative. Or others have.had less well behaved or more inebriated guests and visitors! :)

                                            DavecUK

                                            I am aware u had a very early example of the nurri leva to test. On thd other hand i have been using the nurri every day since I got it in December and i have to point that the travel direction and the force required of the paddle make such an occurrence quite improbable - unless one actually engineers it to happen.

                                            A physically recessed button sounds easier to depress than a touchscreen option on a menu…

                                            While i suppose for the uniquely-“talented” toaster submerging brigade :), it may always be possible to have any type of accident but if that’s the case, then for them even a physically recessed button can be accidentally triggered at the wrong time … so it seems to me thar both situations belong to the same improbable category for everybody else…

                                              Yes which is finally why we asked what speed the lever would come back up at 🤣

                                              Got there in the end

                                              Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                                                Cuprajake

                                                I don’t understand what u mean, Jake. Could u clarify what u mena by getting where in the end? The lever handle comes up at a smooth and safe speed when the venting function is actuated.

                                                    chlorox

                                                    I think Jake would like to see a video of the lever rising after the paddle has been used to depressurise the group at the start of a shot or with a blind basket.
                                                    I promise to do one for the Vostok when I get it if one hasn’t already surfaced by then.

                                                    Take it easy friend, you have a lovely highly capable machine.
                                                    People are interested in it and will delve deeply into its capabilities and idiosyncrasies.
                                                    Comments are just that not complaints nor insults.

                                                        Amberale

                                                        I was not offended by what Cuprajake said. I literally did not understand what Cuprajake meant and thus was asking for him to clarify what he meant so that i can reply.