Agreed, they’ll want to do a truckload of testing with alternative burrs before they sell any. And it may simply be something they have no interest in.

Dave has started with a mini test with 2x SSP burrs. The key issue I suspect is the burr dimensions. I’m equipped with a dozen or so burr sets the Micrometer that Dave recommends and I will initially measure all burr sets and record.

Based on my testing to date with variousvgrinders, the significant (and helpful) difference with the Duo versus the DF83 is that the former uses coil springs versus the latter’s wave spring which gives the Duo a fraction greater depth tolerance. Meaning it will tolerate a marginally thicker burr than the DF83.

    tompoland - there’s more to it though. Will it pack the burrs in an optimal way leading to close to zero retention, will it grind at an acceptable speed, will it have enough torque from a “cold” start, etc,etc.

    testing testing testing!

      Agreed. Lots to unpack. But measuring is the first step. And as I take each step I’m in touch with James N. He’s in the loop. And I’m sure Dave will be as generous as ever with guidance too.

      People will still put SSP in there regardless, just because.

      Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

        Yeah

        Niche won’t supply another burr, it’s not in their interest. It’s also not in their interest to supply blank carriers, esp when they know people will fit non recommended burrs and while I have no worries the motor will take them it’s a warranty nightmare for niche.

        Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

          Cuprajake - yep. I see the point. Will they offer burr sets including carrier for those who wish to try filter/espresso? Maybe they will, and then those willing to swap burrs may just use that. Same for all those who bought the Duo with both burr sets. I bet people will try things out.

          Thing is, if they don’t and there’s demand, someone (aftermarket) will. They will simply copy the part, which I bet might cause even more damage due to poor standards and tolerances on manufacturing of those by third parties. Interesting times ahead in this segment for sure.

            MediumRoastSteam If I were Niche, I would not supply anything in addition to your original purchase.. It just becomes too complicated. They are in the market of supplying grinders they designed. If you really want to play around, if it means that much too you, then do what @tompoland did and buy two! Most of this SSP chat is pure guff, the sort that forums seem to specialise in

              dfk41 you really want to play around, if it means that much too you, then do what @tompoland did and buy two

              I personally would use as it comes. I have no interest in spending silly money on a burr set. I don’t know where you got that idea from!

              But there are two things I read about:

              • quite a few enthusiasts (Not me!) bought the duo to try different burr sets.
              • There are enthusiasts on Home Barista who already have the burr sets and can’t wait to receive their Duo with both burr sets so they can install their SSP burrs instead of having the filter burrs.

              I have an email exchange with Niche and they say they might offer the separate filter burr set including carrier as spares in the future. Not sure how this will work, but my question was aimed at those who bought the duo with espresso burr set only and in the future would like to venture out in the filter territory. Whether they will or not only time will tell.

                MediumRoastSteam I’ve seen a lot of references to burr packing or feed rate especially when brought up with RPM but little to no in depth discussions on its effects in particular, do we know this has a significant impact and if so why?

                Cuprajake why do you think the motor will take it when it’s not been tested for aftermarket burrs? If anything the GG burrs stalling in the NZ shows that this is not a given, no matter how well optimised the motor is for the original Mazzers.

                  FadedFrontiers re: burr packing. I don’t. All I know is that the Duo has been tested extensively and there’s an optimal speed for given burrs. Dave discussed this in one of his posts in one of the threads. I’ll see if I can find it, but don’t hold your breath!

                  edit:

                  https://coffeetime.freeflarum.com/d/972-flat-burr-niche-mod/31

                  https://coffeetime.freeflarum.com/d/1713-df64v-variable-speed-ongoing-review/58

                  https://coffeetime.freeflarum.com/d/1605-niche-duo-83mm-flat/96

                  FadedFrontiers why do you think the motor will take it when it’s not been tested for aftermarket burrs? If anything the GG burrs stalling in the NZ shows that this is not a given, no matter how well optimised the motor is for the original Mazzers.

                  Go find a grinder that will grind green coffee from a standing start! If it will do that, it’s going to grind with other burrs. The HU espresso and the Brew SSPs work fine in the grinder. In fact the Espresso SSP burrs take almost 50% longer to grind, which clearly means the grinder is under even less load with those compared to the supplied espresso burrs.

                  The espresso burr is the one used on the Royal and is a single/3 phase burr.

                    FadedFrontiers

                    Because I’ve used it 1 with SSP and 2 I’ve ground high altitude green beans with it,

                    From my dealings with niche they were very hesitant to going anywhere near SSP.

                    Now is that just a supply chain thing maybe,

                    Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                    Being Devil’s advocate here:

                    To @FadedFrontiers ’s point, it’s a fact the Gorilla burrs stalled the Niche Zero. So maybe the motor of the Zero is not as strong as the Duo? Or maybe the the Gorilla burrs cause more load on the motor? (Contrary to SSP). Will the Zero grind green coffee from a standing start? (No, I’m not testing it!)

                    But to @DavecUK ’s and @Cuprajake ’s point, I think it is acceptable the Duo is more than capable of handling SSP burrs given the comments above.

                      IIRC from Dave, it’s the same motor, same gear box, and custom wound for Duo (hence different). The zero perhaps consume a bit more power than the duo.

                      Re-load on the motor, I did raise this point / doubt elsewhere on this thread earlier and in my chat with Dave that sporting another burrs set might put more pressure on the motor (and gear box). It might therefore require different customisation, RPM, and prolonged testing for a given burrs set than designed and tested for mazzer. We won’t know unless alternate burrs are tested extensively.

                      Perhaps, are these the reason why the other grinders have significantly significantly higher motor power and faster RPM? But, some may still stall.

                        MediumRoastSteam Will the Zero grind green coffee from a standing start? (No, I’m not testing it!)

                        Dave or James from Niche can test and advise us! 😁

                        I’ve been told of another forum that the zero can stall with light roasts, I’ve never seen it personally, but it’s possible.

                        But for me it’s never been a light roast grinder

                        And if you are ‘into’ light roasts you wouldn’t go straight for a niche zero imo. You would already be looking at flats, the burr set in the zero is a middle of the road for me, it’s good enough for Joe bloggs who just wants coffee and it’s good enough for us nerd who want a bit more out of coffee. Don’t forget, and I can believe I’m saying this, but the zero is a cheap grinder, esp for when it came out.

                        Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                        DavecUK Go find a grinder that will grind green coffee from a standing start! If it will do that, it’s going to grind with other burrs.

                        I would have expected the Niche Zero to have been able to as well given the similarities with the Duo, so in that case the Zero is incapable of it?

                        LMSC It might therefore require different customisation, RPM, and prolonged testing for a given burrs set than designed and tested for mazzer. We won’t know unless alternate burrs are tested extensively.

                        Exactly my point, not been done and that’s fine but there’s now a rush to create aftermarket 83mm burrs so more will be appearing. Can’t rule out NZ GG happening again but with a new pair of 83mms in the future.

                        Regarding Niche selling extra burr carriers, that’s not going to stop people swapping out burrs regardless. They might as well make extra money from it and have the disclaimer that warranties are void if using other burrs or something.