Taste Differences Between Varia VS3 Gen 2 Burr Options ?

MWJB
The data is direct from Varia’s own charts. Their chart is scientifically incorrect, since the data has no “Zero”! It CANNOT have a Zero! You can’t grind coffee with the Burrs touching!!
Also the data doesn’t give information inbetween the points.
Their chart actually shows one of the curves going BELOW zero!! The data itself doesn’t…
As well as “correcting” Varias presentation of the data, I’ve used Excel to present the relative % of the part of the Distribution that is required for good Espresso - BELOW 400 nano meter.

This analysis shows that Coffee Reviewers opinions about the Burrs are often “Counter-Factual”.
The “Black Titanium” Burrs MUST be considered and tested as potentially “the Best for Traditional Espresso”, closely followed by the Gold Titanium. The one’s often favoured by the pundits the “Hypernova” and the “Hpernova Ultra”, just may be good for Light Roasted Espresso’s?? I really wouldn’t know, since I would never drink such a brew…
Of course the two “Hyper” Burrs are more expensive - so the dealers want us to buy them…

Just because a Burr has a “Superior Looking” name, don’t make it better!
Just because a pundit say’s “It’s better for Espresso” don’t make it so! (Especially if that pundit drinks light roasts…)
I bought the “Black Titanium” based on Varia’s data. My experience says that I like it for traditional Espresso with dark roast beans!

P.S. Sorry the charts didn’t come in the correct position in my post - I’m new to this forum, and couldn’t work out how to re-position them.
- - -
About the Burr Diagram, showing my suggested rectification for the Dial Moving issue.
That Washer must be to precise tolerances, the same dimensions as the Bearing. It must be either 1mm or 2mm, or 3mm, not inbetween~, to ensure that the zero marker will be in the right place,
It needs to be made from high quality engineering grade stainless steel, so as not to bend under the constant buffeting within the grinding chanber!
I think that regular 304 steel would bend far too easilly… Especially if just 1mm was tried. 2mm of 304 just MIGHT be strong enough?

The chart for Filter Brews and Drips is in another chart.
For the various Brew methods, the Gold Titanium SHOULD BE looked at as potentially “the Best”…

Regards Greg (Stellar, not because I think I’m great, but because another of my interests is in the Stars - both Astronomy and Sidereal Astrology.)~

StellarGreg Don’t dismiss the “Black Titanium” version!
Looking at the distribution data that Varia have provided, it gives the MOST fines, and therefore should give the most “traditional” espresso with darker roasts, which are my preference!

I have transferred the data from your chart you posted and made a cumulative chart (hit the link & scroll down), these are easier to read as non-cumulative charts are hard to decipher.

The 0.59% at 1200 for the Iridescent looks a bit anomalous, but then it’s only a tiny fraction of the grinds. Beyond that, however the data was determined, the standard deviations of the grinds depicted look pretty similar, Black is finest, Steel & Plasma seem to be set a bit coarser, irrespective of the number shown on the grinder setting ring.

VS3 grind data

If you see any obvious errors, let me know.

Thanks for your reply, however I don’t find the cumulative view as intuitive as the straight data graph.

For the Espresso information, it might be better to Cumulate the date the other way so that the 100% corresponds to the fines?
For Espresso you want fines and no boulders.
For Filter, etc. You don’t want the fines.
So doing the cumulation the opposite way for each would make sense.

Beware you have added a ZERO point. This data CANNOT have a zero point! You cannot grind to zero microns!
Perhaps Google Docs did that for you automatically?
You’ve also allowed Google Docs to interpret data between the data points. The data is actually quite “Coarse”. More points would be ideal. But I havn’t seen many manufacturers info as good as this!
I find the “pointy” style of graph shouts - “This is Coarse Data”, which is correct.

This may be limited by the measuring equipment, which is pretty expensive as it is!

The data is Varia’s. I did check that all the percentages added up to 100%.

The Colours added to the “data percentages” were auto added by Excel, but those that interpret, are based on standard ideas:-
that for Espresso less than 400 microns is best.
for most Filter Methods between 400 microns and 800 microns is best. (but I don’t do filter - - -)

A question - from a newbie here. How do you add that list of your equipment to the bottom of your posts? Can it be done automatically, in the profile?

StellarGreg For Espresso you want fines and no boulders.
For Filter, etc. You don’t want the fines.

All grinds have fines & boulders in proportion relative to the median/average grind size.

Zero microns is ‘no grinds’ (e.g. the % of grinds below 0.1um will be essentially zero, similarly no grinds can pass through the floor of a sifting pan, so the floor of the pan is the cut off/zero for the ground weight/smallest particle size), all grind distributions typically show a zero, or at least decimal points of a um at the smallest end.

If the Sympatec QICPIC was used to determine the plots, as Varia state, then it would have given data for many data points to 3 orders of magnitude (both cumulatively and non-cumulatively). Varia have decided show the data in this unconventional binning, every 200um after 200um upwards - I don’t know why.

Hello friends,

I just bought a VS3 directly from their website and got them yesterday. Made two lattes (last night and this morning) and I’d say the taste was different in a good way. It was a pleasant change from what I’m used to. I had been using Eureka Manuale with a 50mm flat burr. what stood out to me was that the bitterness was less. So much less and the cup became more enjoyable. This was with the stock burr. I also ordered a Hypernova (blue colored burr) since it’s recommended for espresso. Since I drink milk based drink; mostly lattes. I plan to switch to the Hypernova after the first cleaning, maybe in 1-2 weeks, or more, see how I feel.

I always wanted to have 2 types of grinder; flat & conical. Just so I can experience good cup of coffee. That’s all, nothing too technical. Despite reading about some complaints and QC issues with the VS3, I still decided to get one because that fit my budget at the time. I got it for USD325 (for 3 items:- VS3, Hypernova Burr & Sip Glass), and it ended up being about USD370 after all the tax & duty were paid. the VS6 and Niche were not within my budget. I also saw that the Fellow Opus is on discount at my local retailer but after reading reviews, I don’t think I’m going to like it.

I’m hoping the VS3 will be a great addition for me. Let me know if you guys want me to update on my experience after I switch it to the Hypernova burr. BTW, I drink Medium to Dark Roast. I usually take a little sip of the espresso before turning it into lattes. I also new here and I hope I can learn a thing or two from this forum. Cheers!