If you haven't seen it already, @"lancehedrick"#742 has published a nice review of the upcoming Vostok 1 group on Youtube. There is no real surprise for those of us who have followed @"DavecUK"#1 's postings (and the planned improvements for this machine), but its still is a well made video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4UtmXO9zVU I'm sure this will raise interest in ACS… So well done !

some bits were a bit off in terms of correct info, but they do look a great machine. id love one but its too big. most the points picked up on davec already said, now away to spam his comments am i - haha

It's funny (and sad at the same time) to read some of the vitriolic comments on this video which remind me of what happened when the Evo Leva came to the market (probably with the same cast of characters as well!)

@"Eiffel"#p35306 Luckily though, those will not be buying it.....instead, they will continue to push the virtues of the machine they prefer. The Vostok is too complicated for me now! But, I can really see it appealing to a very wide market. Anyone who cannot handle the size, then hopefully many of the features will transfer to the Evo. Hope folks do not quickly start to copy the ideas, or that Paolo patents them correctly

Going by the video, the Vostok 1G is well priced and feature laden. The good news for us, Evo Leva owners, is that we've been able to get exactly the same results for 18 months, albeit without the automation capabilities of the newer machine… In an commercial setting, some of the added features are easier to justify (Automatic termination of shots, timers, some comfort features, etc), but for hobbyist use the upgrade, while tempting, is harder to justify… It's nice to have the choice though as the Evo Leva and Vostok 1G are both great variants of the same base design.

Looking at some of the comments on Lance's video, it's very clear some people haven't got a clue what they are talking about, and have not even bothered to watch the video! i.e.: "How is the group head connected to the brew boiler? I thought it was a dipper design." Err... One of the first things Lance explains is that the machine has 3 heat controllers: for the 2x boilers and for the group.

Question (I have asked this before, and it's in here somewhere, although a while ago). But what's the difference between the Evo and the Vostok? i.e.: Why would I buy one over the other?

well the new vostok comes in a one group, pretty sure it was just a multi group before, the new vostok has all the pressure sensor sides for shot stopping and group evacuation, it has the same boilers and and did have the same group but obs now the vostok has the modded group to allow it to vent, i presume this is just the evo group modded but could be wrong, its also bigger, and imo prettier

@"Cuprajake"#p35327 - Thanks Jake. So, in summary, a V Evo on steroids! 🙂

The Vostok 1G looks like an amazing machine. It goes a bit to far me and imo more complexity is even more stuff to potentially have issues arise with. At least, I am telling myself that so I try to not email ACS and ask to be put on the list for one (ha!) It would be nice though if the Leva had the new pump and the external pre-infusion setting. Has anyone looked at adding the barista lights to the Leva since the controller seems already set up for it?

Lance Hedrick - review of the VOSTOCK

Cuprajake

In the gorilla gears thread

Agree shame for THIS forum

We can’t all agree all the time, but it doesn’t help when people app from THIS forum are telling tales.

tompoland

Cheez Louise. This is getting unbelievable.

DavecUK

chlorox ACS are not a big corporate, so they can do non corporate things and concentrate on their customers.

I also agree entirely that the more advanced levers that come out, the more others have up their game, drop their price…..or quietly fade away.

I am working (again for totally free) with another company and another advanced lever for the market. Plus I discussed another small advanced Lever concept (SAL) yesterday.

As for the whole Lance Hedrick thing I’ve deleted nothing, and fully expect some temporary disruption like we had at the beginning

punkypj

Cuprajake Lance is completely right though, i blocked that user on cfuk and I blocked him on here so I thankfully don’t have to read those posts. It can make following a thread challenging sometimes though.

Cuprajake

punkypj best way, if you’re not a fan, just block its what i do

re my post sometime humor doesn’t come across in typing, my post was tongue in cheek, i didn’t for one second even think about previous history as that was nearly 2 years ago. and something i thought had finally settled down, sadly i see that its still very alive and kicking.

i thought the forum was nice, friendly and very active, maybe people don’t want that or dont want that to succeed, i dunno, its really soured the whole experience for me, if people feel i was part of it, i apologize, nothing i say is done with any intention to hurt people, i genuinely try to help people when i can, you know like giving free stuff away 🥰

dutchy101

Think there’s a huge difference between having a disagreement with a forum member and then publicly slating a forum and calling it toxic, especially when you have the level of following Lance has. Pretty uncalled for. For what it’s worth, I thought Lance had handled the situation well on here, but there was absolutely no need for what he’s done on Instagram.

LMSC

IMHO, subsequent posts went too far and not drawing a line. The insta post was shocking. 🤷🤦‍♂️

Let’s move on please!

dutchy101

LMSC IMHO, subsequent posts went too far and not drawing a line

Reading back the last couple of posts you are right - forgot about some of the later posts when I posted my message earlier.

chlorox

Cuprajake

I have no idea about what the past history that is being referred here was about, being a new member here.

I am merely commenting with just the knowledge of reading the altercation between Hedrick and that other member.

The problem was I believe two fold - first, it was that other member of this forum who basically made serious allegations involving dishonesty against Hedrick just because he was unable to accept Hedrick’s explanation about a power brick being edited out by his cameraman, and second, it was what Hedrick perceived to be this community’s lack of support of him to tell that chap off for his behaviour and for actually seeming to even facilitate that guy’s behaviour. Your joke unfortunately sounded to Hedrick like you were saying that he had a right to make such serious allegations against other members of this forum at will. I am not saying you meant to say that, but Hedrick had a right to be aggrieved, and he was aggrieved, and it was a very sensitive time to be making a joke like that in circs where there is no facial expressions or gestures that can communicate a different intention.

If this forum is supposed to be the nice and friendly place that it is meant to be, people need to act in a nice and friendly way - and when they do not, it is for the moderator to step in to make that abundantly clear to the errant member thathe has crossed the line, and other members need to stand up for that principle and tell the not so nice member (and not the person who was wronged) to be nice. Otherwise the value to be nice and friendly is just a piece of theory that is not going to happen……that’s just my two pence worth on this issue…

Systemic

Coffeetime was set up precisely to avoid what happened on CFUK - I was a moderator on that forum until it was sold to the Canadian company. So, I am in a unique position knowing what was happening both front of house and behind the scenes. Sadly, narratives got pushed, stretched and, at times, misrepresented and distorted.

We don’t want or need that on this forum.

Cuprajake

love how im getting singled out here,

but im getting to the stage of not caring now - im off for now

chlorox

Cuprajake

That was not my intention at all Jake! I know that was not your intention - but I am offering an explanation why Hedrick was not calmed down but was evidently made even more angry…

punkypj

Cuprajake I don’t think you are the main focus of this discussion jake, maybe I missed something though.

LMSC

We are once again seeing signs of finger pointing and disruptions. Jeez, haven’t got anything better to discuss?

People out there are starving, can’t even pay their heating bills, some dying elsewhere of malnutritions and here …?

Life is too short and is like a bubble.

Grow a pair! Move on guys!

I am done posting here.

🙏

dutchy101

LMSC I am done posting here.

Hopefully just in this thread and not the forum itself - it would be a shame to lose good knowledgeable poster like yourself over this.

Platypus

This is all just really sad, there are no winners and a real tragedy for the coffee community as there is just so much knowledge over all 3 sites that has now been diluted . Like a good pour over, the silt at the bottom should be left to settle and agitation kept to a minimum or else everything becomes soured and bitter. I’m not passing judgement on any comments but Putin could drop a bomb on us tomorrow and that would be a tragedy as I have a nice Ethiopian that’s waiting in the wings!

John_Yossarian

chlorox The father is from Cyprus …. surprise, sur😀prise

Frothbewithyou

Like @punkypj I have had him blocked for a while.
This forum has provided many a useful post and helpful person. I was lucky to interact with those people way before my interaction with said user.

Moderation of a forum doesn’t have to be a dictatorship like your previous forum, but having it completely open to people saying and doing whatever doesn’t always have the “welcome” doormat you hope.

I’ll go back to lurking, but I think disagreeing and ignoring are 2 very different things.

Rob1

My 2 cents. You don’t have to engage with somebody on a forum if you don’t want to. You don’t have to take the bait. Some people are very conflict-driven and thrive off of it so it’s always going to be a losing battle trying to engage with them if you just want peace. You are the only person with the ability to control your emotions as you are the only person who can control your thoughts; if you find yourself on the receiving end of comments aimed at you on a forum, before you reply consider what you have to gain and if replying is in line with your reasons for visiting the forum in the first place, if not then simply ignore, don’t let your thoughts wander into areas you don’t want them to. We’re adults and really should have the mental strength and discipline to choose our interactions in an online space; meeting in the real world is not quite the same.

As for Lance’s claim that somebody had to seek therapy because of things DFK said to them. There’s typically only one person who knows why somebody is seeking therapy and that’s the therapist. I find it unlikely somebody has ever required therapy for something that was said to them online by somebody they have either never met or only met briefly; far more likely there are underlying causes the person seeking therapy may not even be consciously aware of. Children who are constantly bullied at school and continue to experience that bullying online is another matter.

Anyway, enough of this for me.

chlorox

Rob1

What you said is true, not just of forums but of life in general. We need to be more mentally resilient (we also need to control our words too…) However it does not address the real issue in this little debacle - which is what sort of forum is this and what sort of forum do members here want it to be? Is it the nice and friendly and knowledgeable forum that it sets out to be - like a gathering at an acquaintance’s house to which we have been invited along with a lot of other people, some we know well and others we don’t know well, and somebody there starts casting slurs at another attendee and suggesting dishonesty on his part and they make a scene. Wouldn’t the host and other attendees there who know the abuser speak to him and tell him he’s out of line and to behave himself, and they also get the victim to calm down as well?

But if all that they do is to just suggest to the abuser that he can rephrase his words on a different way and then they tell the person being accused not to be so sensitive and if he doesn’t like it he can just stop talking to him and ignore him, will the victim not perceive that the attendees appear to be nice and friendly just to the abuser and not to the person being abused?

There is a reason when people get so angry they start posting tweets or Instagram against others. It doesn’t excuse it but there is always a cause. Is there any reason related to how he was treated here apart from the possibility somebody here raised of anyone whispering in his ear and further aggravating him?

Part of calming down a person who feels unfairly treated is to let him see that the slur against him is being publicly rejected there and then. If that is not done, he starts to wonder if the others also feel that way about him too and believe the slur though there is no evidence whatsoever presented to prove it….

If we don’t want it to happen again, it is wise to have a look under the hood when things blow up to see if there is anything that needs fixing before we sweep it under the carpet and go on business as usual…

Cuprajake

Hi all

So it’s been a really shit day,

This whole debacle has been on my mind

I’ve spoken with lance at length

Here are some of the things I’ve taken from our discussion.

The forum generally comes across as a boys club, we condone dfks actions by allowing him to stay, we are not welcoming on this front and appeal to a small minority.

We have been seen to allow bullies to go unchecked.

Lance would like us to implement a zero tolerance attitude, a yellow card system, adding a couple more moderators to the team to police the forum,

He would also like dfk banned from here.

To progress the forum

This whole thing has soured my thoughts once again, I had hoped all this had passed by and settled down over the past year.

Im going to take a back seat now for a while, I’ll see you when I see you.

Rob666

dfk may be outspoken but he is a really helpful and generous guy, both with his considerable knowledge and experience and with practical help. There is plenty of room here for him and for Lance if he chooses to remain. The mantra, “scroll on by” if you don’t like something applies here as with everywhere else on the web.

chlorox

Rob666

I’m sure he is a very generous and helpful person but that isn’t in issue though. What is was his behaviour the other day towards another member of this forum whoch goes quite a long way past the point of just being outspoken…

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