Would the evo be substantially cheaper than 3300 euros now that the vostok is coming out? Otherwise its difficult to stop cannabilising of evo sales by the vostok and there is a need for product differentiatiion
Lance Hedrick - review of the VOSTOCK
The trad levers do fluctuate with every use or flush in terms of temperature so they are more inexact. That’s fine but charging what they charge for 70 year old technology is bad for us consumers. It’s important for acs and nurri and more cpmpanies following theiir example to really make a success of the new line levers in order to make the general coffee market aware of the revolution that is going on and of the new abilities of these machines and that u don’t have to spend Leva X money to achieve it. That way the expectation and demand of consumers will hopefully require the manufacturers to add these capabilities and they become the new industry standard for premium levers. Its about time levers won back some of the market share the pumps won beginning in 1961…
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The automation that allows the shot to be ended automatically at pressure level that is preset is more needed for cafes and would allow for consistency at cafes so the multigroup vostok would bring kees van der westen type capabilities to cafes at a fraction of the price. That’s a big market there if they can get the marketing behind it. For me, the light is still my favourite part of the vostok - I wish all machines and grinders have this feature!
chlorox I don’t know, but I don’t think so. By and large, they have the same components, particularly if ACS updates the Evo with the new features and components (pump and additional logic/controls for timed and pressure shots).
I may be completely wrong, but I don’t think they ‘cannibalise’ each other in the traditional sense; it’s a bit like saying that the 5-door version of a car cannibalises the 4- or 3-door version…
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(Posted in wrong thread!)
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Well the evo if improved would do exactly the same things the vostok can do so its really an older 5 door model vs a newer 5 door….Heres another thought - why is the evo needed at all now? I thought the evo was put together from existing pump machine chassis etc and thus not an ideal ground up design for lever. On the other hand the vostok one group is. So is there a need at all for the evo now that the vostok one group is coming out finally? Especially since it has the same internal parts and especially if the same capabilities will be given to the evo? The uniqueness of the vostok would be diluted by the evo…so logically either keep the evo with its more limited abilities to maintain the vistok as the premium product option in the acs range, or eliminate the evo altogether as being unnecessary now. The latter makes dven more sense if the vostok is sold at 3300 euros - there’s not a lot of room to drop the price on an evo.
chlorox Um. The chassis of the Evo (and the Vesuvius from which it comes) is extraordinarily strong; I don’t know if it costs more or less than that of the Vostok, but I don’t think it’s inferior to it in mechanical terms.
It could make sense to not offer the Evo if that resulted in any saving to ACS, but since they will keep producing the Vesuvius… (and the Minima, and the single- and multi-group Vostok), what benefit would they derive from not offering a slightly smaller machine with a different look, but requiring the same components and zero additional costs? Personally, if they both had been available a year ago, I would have gone with the Vostok, but there are people for whom the larger footprint (and the ‘outré’ looks) are no-go.
It seemed to me from a product marketing perspective that such a choice seems to normally be anathema to a corporation, but I’m no expert there so I’m sure acs would know what to do about that in due time
Lance always does a great job with his videos.
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Just an FYI on social media lance has stated he will no longer visit the forum,
Undoubtedly we will now see an influx of haters, looking to disrupt.
Perhaps that was the intention of those who went out of their way to speak with lance, alas, being ghosted so we can’t explain.
Sorry peeps
Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -
chlorox Plenty of examples from cars to consumer electronics going both ways… with significant success (or failure), indicating that the presence of strongly overlapping products in and of itself is not what matters.
chlorox I think it was on the “Gorilla Gear” for the Niche thread. As far as I know, all still there.
In the gorilla gears thread
Agree shame for THIS forum
We can’t all agree all the time, but it doesn’t help when people app from THIS forum are telling tales.
Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -
Cheez Louise. This is getting unbelievable.
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chlorox ACS are not a big corporate, so they can do non corporate things and concentrate on their customers.
I also agree entirely that the more advanced levers that come out, the more others have up their game, drop their price…..or quietly fade away.
I am working (again for totally free) with another company and another advanced lever for the market. Plus I discussed another small advanced Lever concept (SAL) yesterday.
As for the whole Lance Hedrick thing I’ve deleted nothing, and fully expect some temporary disruption like we had at the beginning
Think there’s a huge difference between having a disagreement with a forum member and then publicly slating a forum and calling it toxic, especially when you have the level of following Lance has. Pretty uncalled for. For what it’s worth, I thought Lance had handled the situation well on here, but there was absolutely no need for what he’s done on Instagram.
IMHO, subsequent posts went too far and not drawing a line. The insta post was shocking. 🤷🤦♂️
Let’s move on please!