I get 9 bar with the blind basket.
Unless I’m mistaken, the videos appear to show the water coming from the safety valve. However, i can confirm the water going back into the tank is not too hot.
When i draw steam, however, it appears to be overly forceful and spluttering.
europa The vacuum breaker vents to the drip tray, so it’s the expansion valve or as @MediumRoastSteam says, could be the safety valve. It’s difficult to tell, but in the first video, there appears to be bubbles emanating from the safety valve? Does this always happen? The cameras moving around a lot so difficult to see.
From your description there appears to be multiple errors
So many problems, that might or might not be happening, I am having trouble just zoning in on things in a deluge of “possible” information. You need to compartmentalise this and work through a series of logical steps to figure this out. Let me give you some examples, of my thought processes….
Is the service boiler over filling - open steam wand and run pump against a blind filter, or next time it autofills open steam wand. (It is tricky with the hot water, because it always takes that from the brew boiler). or remove a fitting and look (cold boiler of course)?
Isolate the tube from the safety valve…is the water actually coming from there…or the vacuum breaker
Is that clunking a solenoid, or the safety valve popping open and closed (if it’s the safety valve) then the only thing wrong with the machine might be a faulty safety valve. It’s why I asked if you could feel (with a wooden dowel) any solenoids clicking). Although it doesn’t explain why the pump runs on…perhaps another fault with the level probe wire.
The thing is, with the Elizabeth, the safety valve is always flooded by the water coming from the expansion valve, through the X connector, down to the “door” of the safety valve. Safety valve gets hot, boils the water, and makes the machine gurgle. Nothing wrong, but a poor design from Lelit. I’ve been going on and on about this for a while now. 😊🤌… to the point I have re-routed mine and removed that X fitting. Hasn’t gurgled since, for 1.5 years. 😊
To make sure it’s the safety valve, sending the water from the drip tray you can simple remove the hose from the safety valve to the X fitting and catch the water. But also make sure you catch the water from the exposed X fitting just in case it’s coming from the OPV.
Once confirmed, put a cable tie into those hoses for good measure as they came undone on mine… another reason why I don’t like that X fitting design.
If it’s the safety valve… best to let BB know as there’s something not right.
Good luck.
Thanks a lot for the help, guys. Given the issue isn’t happening all the time, it’s quite difficult (for me) to test all your suggestions, such as removing hoses to isolate the problem. The easiest is probably to just send the machine to BB.
However, for my own info:
@MediumRoastSteam, you say above “To make sure it’s the safety valve, sending the water from the drip tray…” Apols if I’m being very thick, but why would it be sending water from the drip tray?
PS I’ve just rewatched my videos and realised they don’t really show the issue as clearly as I thought. Whilst water and air bubbles are clearly moving through the tube from the safety valve, there is no sign of any water/air moving through the tube from the OPV (but that could also be because there are no air bubbles, so hard to see movement!)
europa sending the water from the drip tray
Sorry, not you but me! That should read "To make sure it’s the safety valve sending the water to the water tank you can simple remove the hose from the safety valve to the X fitting and catch the water.
europa there is no sign of any water/air moving through the tube from the OPV (but that could also be because there are no air bubbles, so hard to see movement!)
Remove the X fitting out of the equation and see where the water is coming from. That’s the only way to be sure really.
BB has just come back asking me to do a citric-acid descale. Apparently, error code 3 can be caused by scale.
europa - What sort of water have you been feeding the machine with? Isn’t your machine relatively new, like 1 year old or so? I think if it was limescale you’d see other signs, some calcium deposits around the X connector and on the dispersion plate. IMO, at least.
Lockhills.
It’s 15 mths old.
I also doubt it’s scale, but probably one of those formalities BB suggests first.
Just a quick update after following @DavecUK descaling instructions. To rinse out the descaler, i emptied and refilled the service boiler several times (as the water was quite grey). At no point did i observe the pump-running-on issue during the process. Then, this morning i switched on the machine and, again, no issue. However, a little while ago, the problem reapppeared. This is what i did:
I switched on service boiler and waited for it to reach temp.
I extracted some water from the hot-water wand to warm the cup.
This triggered a short auto refill of the service boiler. No problem so far.
After about one minute, however, the pump started again and did not stop until i extracted some steam from the steam wand.
Having observed more closely, it looks as though the water to the tank is not actually coming from the steam-boiler safety valve after all. Instead, it appears to be coming through the OPV. It is also at about the same temp as the water in the tank. So, my guess is: something is calling for a refill; however, the brew boiler and steam boiler are already full (so all valves are closed). As the water has nowhere to go, the OPV opens and lets it through. If this is correct, the water is simply being pumped from the tank via the OPV and back to the tank again. Does that make any sense?
PS BB has just come back with the following suggestions:
- take out the level probe examine and clean, as necessary. [should be fairly simple]
- check how close your micro switch is to the brew lever. This could be false triggering. [this I don’t understand]
europa the OPV opens and lets it through. If this is correct, the water is simply being pumped from the tank via the OPV and back to the tank again. Does that make any sense?
That does make sense.
Your machine does not have a brew lever, that would be for an E61 machine.
Further update. Spoke to Chris @ BB yesterday. For some reason, he thought i had a Profitec, hence the brew lever thing.
Anyway, after i suggested the solenoid valve could be the issue, he suggested i remove the solenoid to check the magnetic field. Haven’t bothered with that yet as i haven’t had the issue since, and the valve is working during normal auto fills. Also, found an app called Danfoss Magnetic Tool. This uses the magnetometer in one’s smartphone to detect a magnetic field. It actually works!
Another thing i did was to inspect the level probe. Strangely, it was so loose that pulling on the connector pulled the probe itself upwards. So i tightened the smaller nut, removed the connector and unscrewed the whole unit. No sign of anything at all on the probe. I replaced it and then removed the filling tube from the steam boiler. Again, nothing untoward there. The only slightly-odd thing was that it was not pushed down to the black mark (that is made by the technicians during production). So i pushed it down a bit further when replacing it.
So far so good. Tho’ i suspect i won’t be trouble free for long hehe.
Keep us posted @europa!
It’s been three days since i removed and reinstalled the steam-boiler-level probe and filling tube and no more issues! No idea what the exact cause was, but fingers crossed the issue is now resolved.
