MediumRoastSteam Bruce Pappas

Yeah! He is the one on that video. That’s why, I think. 😊

He did the calibration wrong.

I was watching in live chat, the vid was terrible 😂

The guy didn’t even read the manual, then set zero point at burrs locked. Not chirp like the manual says.

I spoke with hoon after the video, showed him on my test grinder and he spoke with Bruce who did comment in his vid section

Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

  • LMSC replied to this.

    LMSC They were sent grinders from the first full production test run. Which is as close to final production as you can get.

    The first look had me grinding my teeth a bit, as the live stream and Mr Hoons encouragement, led the user to do things that he absolutely had not been prepared to do. Clearly the instruction book hadn’t even been looked at. This is not the way to do things.

    The guy started moving the grind indicator ring around after unlocking it. This is not good as they are factory calibrated. I then saw photos of the burrs removed, If indeed these were the burrs in the users grinder this shouldn’t really be done, unless you mark the burr and the carrier so it goes back absolutely the same way.

    He then proceeded to set the zero point (calibration is the wrong word) as if it was a Niche zero you absolutely don’t set it that way with the duo. The grinder was then run with the burrs tightly together, due to the excitement of the live stream.

    There are two types of calibration with the zero:

    • Finding the burr touching point, which you might do if you accidentally unlock the black indicator ring and twiddle it about. This is your basic one, but it is factory set.
    • If you remove the burr from either carrier and don’t mark it up, ideally you then need to find the “sweet spot”. This involves rotating the top burr into all three positions. Initially finding the touch point for position 1. Moving the pointer to zero, then for remaining 2 positions you see if you get a + or - touch point. Finally setting the zero at the lowest number you get (which may be minus.

    e.g. Position 1, you set to zero, position 2 touches at -2 and position 3 touches at +1. You would choose position 2 as the sweet spot and place your up-per burr in position 2, remove the existing “set” sticker and place a new one at the 12 O clock position.

    When you do this the burrs and grinder must be absolutely clean.

    Pro Tip: For espresso, start at 10 on the Niche, not 20, if the grind time for 18g is around 20s then your in the right ball park, if it’s like 18s or less, you will get a fast shot.

      Cuprajake I must applaud your patience. I can never sit through a live session!

      DavecUK Wow! You watched the whole thing.

      I saw the first few minutes and went into the FF mode as I couldn’t be asked.

      I was surprised the user fiddled with calibration, when there was no need.

      The packaging clearly indicates the burr sets are ready to go.

      Thanks for the tip re-the espresso starting point. I think Jake dials around 5-8.

        LMSC Thanks for the tip re-the espresso starting point. I think Jake dials around 5-8.

        His is an early preproduction unit, refinements since then

          DavecUK Yeah! He did say, his settings would have moved in production.

          DavecUK Are you going to or allowed to publish your full in-depth review of the Duo - like Zero and the rest - please? Thx

            LMSC Are you going to or allowed to publish your full in-depth review of the Duo - like Zero and the rest - please? Thx

            As I was involved heavily in it’s design and development, I feel it’s not really appropriate for me to do that. It’s why I have been very quiet about it and not put out any video. Best let those testers who have used it for the last 6 months to give their impressions if they want to.

              dutchy101 Ah diamonds. Got to be up there with the biggest rip-off ever conceived by man.

              If you ever want to know the true value of a diamond - try and sell it tback to a jeweller / dealer. I saw a show on TV where a woman brought in a Tiffany diamond ring, with a little certificate guarantee that the diamond in the ring was worth £12,000. The dealer just laughed when she handed it to him. He bought it off her for £3,000.

              Probably to sell on again at £12,000 or more - with the lillte certificate. Lol

              Agreed on the ripoff factor, certainly in relation to retail prices. That particular example wasn’t retail, though. It was a private viewing at a diamond cutting company in Amsterdam, and it wasn’t a business that even sells to the public. I have no idea how that valuation related to what retail prices would have been, and to be clear, it wasn’t a piece of jewelry with that rock in it, it was just the bare diamond. It was also one of, oh, about a thousand stones on display. I shudder to think what the value of he whole lot was. Not that any of that matters in terms of the point I was making, or in terms of how big a rip-off is if buying pretty much any form of jewelry, retail. I still remember the stink when Geerald Ratner was, ummm, a bit too frank about the true value of stock in Ratner’s shops. It is a very good example of how “value” and price can be very, very different if you build up enough glitz and glamour about the product. I could say the same about most ‘designer’ clothes, and personally, my opinion is that I could add Rolex watches to that list, too. But I;m really getting way off topic now. Again. :D

              DavecUK That’s a real shame. It was your ??18?? Page review of the NICHE that convinced me to buy it. I’d love to read your detailed review. You could always make a declaration of interest so to speak

              Sorted

              Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

              profesor_historia of curiosity, you only have espresso? Like all the time, never brew?

              That’s correct. Espresso based drinks. Espresso after lunch, and a flat white in the morning.

              I did try brewed coffee before, and I do have brewed coffee when I visit family, as they don’t have espresso machines. They live in Brazil, and just drink box standard coffee, which interestingly doesn’t give me an insane headache or other issues. If I drink my own brewed coffee (I did try it for a while - V60, Clever, Moka pot, aeropress) with the coffees I normally buy, I have headaches and sometimes stomach upsets.

              Espresso doesn’t give me any problems, unless I drink too much. So I keep it to 2 doubles per day. 3 at a push.

              Interestingly enough, when chatting to a work colleague a while back about coffee - he is from Sweden - he had exact same issues and only drank espresso!

                I’m the same pretty much espresso, I’ve been drinking more filter of for obvious reasons,

                Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                MediumRoastSteam That’s correct. Espresso based drinks. Espresso after lunch, and a flat white in the morning.

                I did try brewed coffee before, and I do have brewed coffee when I visit family, as they don’t have espresso machines. They live in Brazil, and just drink box standard coffee, which interestingly doesn’t give me an insane headache or other issues. If I drink my own brewed coffee (I did try it for a while - V60, Clever, Moka pot, aeropress) with the coffees I normally buy, I have headaches and sometimes stomach upsets.

                Similar here, though timings vary a bit. First cup normally after breakfast. Second mid-morning, and often a third either early PM (after lunch) or early evening (after dinner). Probably 98% espresso-based, though which variant is entirely mood dependent, but usually a capuccino, or my version of a white Americano.

                I do drink brews from time to time (Clever or V60), mainly if I’m not in the mood to faff with espresso machine.

                Filter burr speed, 16g of amoc Ethiopian filter roast.

                And a look at how the top interface with the upper burr carrier.

                Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                5 days later

                Jake, the point you make on the other thread is interesting:

                Cuprajake Drawing from personal experience with testing the duo,

                People have been quick to jump on the price £800 and saying sell it with one burr for £100 less

                Now the burrs retail £80 ish, now this values the carriers at £20.

                But you read the comments, and they are justifying £200 for 50g of metal because CNC is an expensive procedure., For the wafo but in the next breath they put down cnc niche carriers

                Just found it kinda funny.

                Being part of the niche launch has really opened my eyes to the coffee industry/community and I’d say not all of it good.

                The Duo is an interesting concept, and… it’s a Duo. You can swap between filter and espresso on the burrs it comes with. That’s great, but It’s not for everyone. Certainly not for me, purely for the fact I don’t drink filter. If I did, I’d buy one, because I quite like the idea of one grinder where you can benefit from dedicated burr sets with only one grinder sitting on the bench. I can’t have two, so they would fit the bill.

                But I am not their intended audience, and presumably there are many people like me out there.

                I’m not Niche, I wish them all the best and I am not a mechanical engineer, nor claim to be one. But for me, an 83mm flat burr grinder with a simplified burr carrier where you can’t swap the burrs as easily - Call it the Niche Uno Flat if you wish - would have fit the bill for me, and if it was £150 cheaper, even better.

                Ps: I’ve seen the Duo, used one and had coffee from it. It’s a well designed grinder, and I really like it.

                My two pence worth.

                  MediumRoastSteam

                  I’d second this. I don’t drink filter coffee very often now, my V60 hasn’t moved in probably a year so, for me also the additional burr would be wasted on me.

                  I guess it’s a bit like my gym membership; it includes access to the pool but I don’t swim so I’m paying for something that I don’t and will likely never take advantage of.