ACS Minima vs Lelit Mara X

Snooze I’ll leave that question to the forum community as a whole… 😉

dutchy101 yeah at this point I’m really close to pulling the trigger on the Minima but I’m still considering other options to make sure I won’t regret it. I do like the look of the ECM and Bezzera but they all look more expensive too.

DavecUK haha ok. But your opinion is quite valuable that why I was asking! :)

Snooze

You’re doing the right thing. Take your time and weight up the pros and cons and make the right choice when you pull the trigger. What’s right for someone else might not be right for you

Rancilio Silvia Pro X is another dual boiler in that price range. Reviews seem to be pretty good, and @drdre89 seems happy with his.

Doram agreed! But just to clarify my situation: not knowing all the machines on the market (and their interiors), I’m seeking recommendations from folks who know better than me the machines available on the market so I can compare with what I have gathered so far (some forums seem to really push for the Breville Dual Boiler for example. I’m sure it packs lots of features for the price and produce good coffee, but the build and design is not for me. So while it was their recommendation, it didn’t tilt me toward the BDB). So in the end I’m not asking anyone to make a decision for me either. Although hearing what one would choose and why can help gather informations to make an informed decision. I guess my post history shows that I didn’t go with the first recommendation I’ve got since I’ve been comparing the pros and the cons of different machines over the last weeks.
And you’re right about the biaises we have!! Especially during the honey moon phase.
But folks here generally seem to be quite informed and as such appear to have a good judgement. So I definitely take their inputs seriously.
But you’ll likely see me changing my mind many time during the upcoming weeks! But I certainly don’t want to be too dense for anyone with my multiple questions!!
Anyhow, thanks everyone for your inputs. It’s really appreciated.

Long post warning!!

DavecUK, I like that. Although I’m really just looking to know if there are other good options to consider outside Silvia Pro X, MaraX, Elizabeth, Minima and Bianca. Or maybe something coming soon. Those are the main one I found that could respond to my needs but I surely don’t know the whole market (Bezzera, ECM and Profitec seem interesting but all more expansive). All this in case I missed a good option.

I’m still an enthusiasts at the deep low of the Dunning–Kruger Effect curve! Hence the hesitation - although the real show stopper is always money ressources, otherwise I could “afford” making the wrong choice (and buy a Decent for example!). Which I’m trying to avoid.

To answer your question, my list (so far a top 8!) would look like that:

1 - Ability to control and “see” the main espresso brewing parameters with repeatability (with sufficient accuracy to be noticeable in the end result - i.e. I can sometimes get an espresso with my Oscar II that is as good as the with MaraX, except I don’t know what was the state of each parameters).

2- Targeted cost around 1500£-ish - I would prefer something around the cost of the MaraX/Minima but may extend to the Bianca range to get an “end game” machine!

3- High reliability/quality, parts easily available, designed for easy maintenance and information/support available to allow me to service/repair once it will broke/age.

4- Efficiency: Steaming and brewing capability at the same time without affecting the end result (i.e. sufficient thermal stability to avoid a noticeable impact to the end result). My Oscar II allow me to have a cortado made within 3 minutes from scratch to a cleaned area ready to go back to work. But doesn’t respond to criteria #1 very well.

5- Noise level somewhere between a MaraX and a Oscar II. Ideally like the MaraX. So it doesn’t have to be a rotary pump.

6- Well thought user interface allowing good efficiency. For example I like machines with steam lever instead of valves. But that would not be a show stopper.

7- Aesthetic - Most espresso machine are to my taste except if it is a non neutral colour (I would not get a yellow machine) or if they look cheap.

8- Medium sized, but flexible as long as it fits in my kitchen. A lever machine is not really an option though. Maximum height of 40cm to fit under the cupboard (a paddle like the Bianca can stick out at the front as long as roughly half the machine fits under).

That’s about it for now I think. I may have to revisit.

Note that when I say noticeable, I wish I had an objective way to express it into a measurable way but let’s assume “noticeable to someone with great taste sensitivity without being an expert”!!!

P.S. The Minima with a flow control seems to fit the bill so far. With obviously the Bianca but quite expansive. I would rather get a better grinder (Currently have a Mignon Silenzio) if it’s worth it. That’s for another thread! :)

Personally, if sound is not an issuse i would not hesitate to go buy a Vesuvius.

Pressure profile machine 100% repeatable,

I have the bianca, and while the paddle is good, you will never repeat what you did last time as you are the human variable, you can save a shot on the fly though.

Had the £2000 Vesuvius deal been around when i got the bianca, there would be one on my counter.

If you want repeatability then as good as the marax is, its still an hx, theres the Elizabeth and minima next. I too loved the liz features but not the looks,

There are the bezzers machines, which look really nice, on has the electronic group too, vut this means no flow control, which is why i didnt get one in the end, id of kicked myself, but with the led and clear sides it looks cool as.

I think you can obsess over every finite detail. I do the same, but once you get to a certain level theres not much between machine, certainly not enough that you’re going to miss out on flavour, dont forget its the grinder that effects that most, and also the coffee you drink.

When you factor in a flow control then theres not that much in the price minima vs bianca

I would double check where your placing theachine to, as if the minima is tight in a right hand corner working on the steam arm could be a tad awkward, like wise if the bianc was stuffed in a ledt corner youd have the same.

If you had space you could pick up one of the many used majors that are for sale for less than 300 you would see a marked improvement in the coffee.

What type of coffee do you tend to drink, sorry of i missed that..

Minima is the best bang for buck id say. Dont dorget you will get some money back on your eureka grinder as there a fan favourite too

I can’t be of much help beyond the excellent advice you received already, but I bought my machine towards the end of last year and went through a very similar thought process to you - importantly, along with the budget creep.

I initially thought I wanted the Mara X but was also considering the Bianca, it’s a superior machine and I knew if I bought that any thoughts of upgrading in a year or two wouldn’t arise.

But there was a Vesuvius offer direct from ACS at the time which meant that I could order one of those for a very similar price to the Bianca. I chose the Vesuvius and unsurprisingly have no regrets. I’ve had it 4 months and have already forgotten about the cost. Sometimes budget creep is no bad thing if it avoids future regrets. I took the view that buying once was better than buying twice.

Cuprajake well here in Canada it’s a difference the equivalent of 1100£. If I were able to get the deal I almost had then the gap would have been smaller (still working on that deal though so the Bianca is not ruled out yet).

I’ll have to do more research on the grinders since that is really unknown to me.

Cuprajake forgot to respond to your question about the type of coffee I drink. I’m really into trying everything lately and this is where my setup showed some of its limitation. These days I’m into light-med roasted coffee and I really enjoy it except my setup always a bit more acidic taste that I would be able to reduce with a finer grind (if I think I had more preinfusion, slow ramp up pressure). That seems to be the most logical reason why I preferred the result with the MaraX when I did a side by side comparison (played with grind setting, ratio, time, same basket, etc.) and the MaraX was almost always sweeter. It really made a more balanced coffee.

Gagaryn it really look like a nice machine. It really seem to be an end game machine. Although with the prototype I saw from Dave’s video with the Minima, it is very promising and may make the Minima a smaller version of the Vesuvius.

@DavecUK, do you know if the “original” Minimas (or I should say the one they seek right now) will be able to be relatively easily retrofitted for this product if it becomes available (if the current one is not the V2 as you mentioned in your video)?

Ah canada. That will open up different machines again womt it like quickmill.

Who do you have supply wise over there is it 1stchoice?

Snooze I don’t know if the prototype with pressure and flow control will ever become reality. It would require some internal rewiring.

DavecUK ok thanks Dave.