coffeealex One thing to bear in mind is that there are also commercial interests… which are probably changing/recently changed considering the acquisition of Lelit by Breville/Sage.

I haven’t owned either, but I considered both (and the ECM Synchronika) a few months ago when deciding what machine to get, and ultimately I reached the following conclusion/summary:

+ for ECM/Profitech: construction/assembly, reliability (minor +)
+ for Lelit: innovation/features, upgradeability, footprint and cost (particularly assuming flow profiling is required/desirable)

Looks are subjective - of the 3, I would prefer the Synchronika because I prefer levers to knobs for steam/water (and a few months ago the levers weren’t even an option on the Profitec).

In the end, had I gone for an E61 machine, I would have picked the Bianca because of its innovation, footprint and cost. What did I buy? A lever machine that is innovative, very well built, but has a large footprint and costs even more than the ECM. Go figure…

    It’s only £10 more expensive than a Nespresso!!!! 🤣

    I’m so tempted to hit “Buy” and see what happens….

      If BB was referring to the stainless of the boilers, I know the Lelit use AISI 316L (commonly known as surgical steel) in the Bianca. I would think Profitec use the same.

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        DavecUK i think he was referring to the steel on the outside. But if Lelit are using surgical grade steel on their boilers then that’s pretty good. Surgical steel has better anti corrosive properties if I am not mistaken

          DavecUK I know you rate both machines highly but purely down to extraction quality are they more or less the same in your opinion? Ie if you put the same coffee/ tamp/flow/ pressure would the shots be more or less the same or would one eg have more crema

              coffeealex got to be something not right? but as you say its tempting to hit buy….,, might turn out to be bye bye to the money

              Likely. I checked the phone number, and it’s from a takeaway restaurant in Southampton. Steer clear!

                  JahLaza is it a typo? £65? They retailing for up around 2k new, is this new or am I comparing different machines?!

                  I think it’s a scam. All items are crazy cheap!

                      coffeealex Afternoon, question for you. One person you seek advice from works on a not for profit expansion of the coffee industry for the benefit of consumers……the other is a coffee salesman! Which one do you think is going to give the more balanced answer and which one is more likely to go and check stock levels and profit margins before he answers!
                      You are not comparing like for like matey. If you do not want to pressure profile then why consider a Bianca? If you want to pressure profile, then why consider a Profitec as it cannot………

                      https://www.suddencardiacarrestuk.org/2024/02/thank-goodness-for-madeira-cake/

                          I second @dfk41 - That was exactly what I was trying to say in my post, but in a more diplomatic way 🤣

                          By the time you add a flow control valve to the Profitec and a gauge, you’ll be approx. £400 (if not more) above the binaca price.

                          That does not give you any of the other features the Bianca has. To put it simply, there’s nothing the Bianca can’t do that the Profitec can.

                          It’s all down to aesthetics and personal preference at the end of the day.

                          Personally, unless you really want a Profitec machine and are convinced that it will make a better coffee because it’s made in Germany, I would defo politely ignore the salesman advice given and go with your instincts for what you want.

                          dfk41 If you want to pressure profile, then why consider a Profitec as it cannot………

                          To be fair, both Profitec and ECM have pressure/flow profiling kits as optional (or as standard in some versions of the 700/Synchronika).

                          I think “we” (yourself, @MediumRoastSteam and I) are all aligned on having to be cognisant of the vested interests of those we seek advice from…

                            JahLaza Sorry - I should have made it clear that this is clearly a scam! I just found it funny that MediumRoastSteam made a typo (missing a zero in the price), but I managed to find a “cheaper” one.

                                coffeealex The coffees that require a simple extraction would be pretty much the same, those that would benefit from flow profiling and bloom phase would not.

                                In addition look at the entire feature set of each machine and decide what best fits your lifestyle. As someone said, you can buy a profiling kit for the Profitec.

                                I may well be updating my old Lelit Bianca review with one for the V3 Bianca….when I get time.

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                                    dfk41 Thanks i get your point. This is the main reason I am on this forum. I think though it is useful to get a viewpoint from all angles even if there is a bias as sometimes a feature is highlighted that you may not be aware of. For me they both are very good machines and I do not think that either would be a poor choice. Again maybe I should take it with a pinch of salt but heard it from more than one employee that they see far less profitec machines breaking down than any other make. If i buy from BB the pressure profiling issue is now slightly redundant as they are not selling going forward any non profiling profitec.

                                    The point is probably best illustrated in the Mark and Java Jim videos which contrast each other. Interestingly enough they both seem to have been taken down from what I can see. I have to say though it does annoy me that lelit chose to put a chrome plated mushroom and not stainless steel. After all the chrome will come off and probably after only 4-8 weeks, which begs the question where does it end up?

                                    I was sold on Lelit, now back to 50/50

                                        DavecUK Thank you. For me they are both great machines with plus and minuses both sides. From a technical point of view ( as I have become more interested with that in time) are they both very serviceable in your opinion? easy to obtain parts? One thing i noticed with the profitec is they have a plug on both boilers that could come in useful for things like fully emptying if you ever needed to descale, although the service boiler one is not as well positioned imo as the brew one. Could be useful feature for draining either and avoiding it travelling through the group e61 parts.

                                            CoyoteOldMan I should have made it clear that this is clearly a scam! I just found it funny that MediumRoastSteam made a typo (missing a zero in the price),

                                            I meant to have written £200 more. I’ve corrected the post now. 👍