DavecUK I need to go back tomorrow and reread your two reviews to remind myself of the differences in detail. Off the top of my head they both had easy to adjust pressures and temperatures, both had solenoid 61 groups so no lube issues after back-flushing. The Elizabeth did 2 types of preinfusion and had presets you could program but doesn’t have a shot timer in its LCC display whereas the Minima does, and I do find the timer useful.

The Elizabeth will be easier to keep nice looking with its satin finish rather polished finish.

Is the Minima more flimsy with thinner guage stainless?

      Minima isnt thin by any measure

      Can add flow control too,

      Only thing i didnt like was the pump noise. But mine was in a corner under cabinets which didnt help, but im super sound sensitive

      Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

      Java_avaJ The Elizabeth will be easier to keep nice looking with its satin finish rather polished finish

      Minima also comes in black and white. And as DavecUK can testify, turquoise

            @DavecUK
            And no danger of the paint peeling?
            Pity turquoise isn’t an option I’d go for that

              Its powder coat so super hard wearing

              Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

              DavecUK ACS don’t do the powder coat in house, that sounds like a bad thing perhaps? However good a paint coat is it’s a coat of paint and on a metal that must expand and contract with the heat it’s surely bound to crack and peel after a year or two - anyone got any experience of that?

              I think I’m sold on the Minima. I’m not sure I need or would use some of the extras on the Elizabeth and can anyone confirm whether the Elizabeth has the E61 Solenoid Operated Group which the Minima has and which sounds such a good idea to reduce work lubing after backflushing?

                  Java_avaJ ACS don’t do the powder coat in house, that sounds like a bad thing perhaps? However good a paint coat is it’s a coat of paint and on a metal that must expand and contract with the heat it’s surely bound to crack and peel after a year or two - anyone got any experience of that?

                  ACS will do what they do well, but They leave the powder coating to expert powder coaters…They Leave main board firmware programming to Gicar, the board manufacturers. Case laser cuttiing and, polishing to the sheet metal company.

                  e.g. You may not know but ACS make their own refrigeration systems for slushie machines etc.., seal them, use special copper tube as well, very smooth and clean inside, higher grade than standard stuff. That’s the same tubing in your machines. Probably doesn’t make any difference (meant to corrode less), but that’s the tube they have in stock.

                  I’m not an expert on powder coat, but it’s a slightly flexible coating, so shouldn’t crack or peel. They did have a few problems a long time ago at first when they didn’t powder coat directly onto stainless, but that was changed pretty quickly, they learn their lesson. Allow wheels on Cars are powder coated and they stand up remarkably well considering the very harsh environment they are in.

                  https://www.reliance-foundry.com/blog/powder-coat-stainless-steel

                  Contact me

                    @DavecUK thank you very much indeed for all your answers, and indeed everyone else who’s commented and lent me their time and expertise.

                    It does make it very difficult to decide I must say. At the moment I just can’t choose between the Elizabeth and the Minima, they both do exactly what I want, the Elizabeth with some extra bells and whistles that might make a quick morning coffee easier, but perhaps not much, the pre-infusion is attractive but the power of the Minima for steaming might well mean I could do one jug of milk for our 2 morning coffees which would save some time.

                    I see no clear ‘winner’ and unless someone replies to suggest that one is better than the other for the following reasons it might well come down to which Mrs Java_avaJ says she prefers the look of ;-)

                    You can add flow control to the minima should you want to control flow

                    The pump in the liz is quieter than the minima though

                    Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                    Elizabeth is a ring-type group rather than the E61 type. Seriously considered one when I was shopping. It would make for very rapid warm-ups and they’re pretty and clever.

                    Alas, couldn’t get CFO past name (ex-wife, lol)

                    My bianca is warm in under 20 mins tbf.

                    Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                    Agreed. The Bianca is an unbelievably good machine - regardless of price, but perhaps a little out of reach for op (and me too, lol!)….my Mara X is also pretty good at warm up, even if not in the same class.
                    Not wanting to sound like a Lelit fanboy, but they’re sure as hell creating waves with some nifty innovative ideas in espresso machinery these days. In Australia, there’s about a $600 gap iirc between the ACS Maxima and the Elizabeth - About $8-900 more than the Mara X…for some, not a problem but the rest of us, well…..

                    5 days later

                    Just to thank everyone again, I’ve decided to get the Minima, I can’t find any uk stockists with stock so I’m getting it through Paolo at ACS, he’s been really helpful. I had thought of a custom colour but have decided to go with classic steel. The only problem now is my grinder doesn’t arrive until March and it’s taking me 7 minutes to do 30gms with my hand grinder 😀

                      Java_avaJ Handheld drill?

                      That was my solution when I was using an aergrind with my espresso machine, while waiting for the niche to arrive.

                        Congratulations, great choice, couldn’t get the looks past my CEO, lol..
                        Omg, thats so long… it’s no Aergrind, probably a wretched Porlex, lol