DavecUK You are getting a great deal, on excellent quality expensive coffee and a top quality roast. The roaster is taking massive hit and even with the aggregators margin added on, it’s a bargain.

I agree that is it very unlikely that you are actually getting a good deal from these multi subscription services as a whole and most of the exclusive lots aren’t that great (I have had a couple that were stellar but it might have been more luck than anything). But also most roasters do take massive hit on profits for these subscription services so most of the profits ends up with the middle men

LMSC Countless experiences like these taught me contacting roasters re-a bad batch offer little value to the end consumers like self. :-)

I will say that is very hard, I have had the same issues as you and sometimes roasters can talk to you as though you are an idiot even if you know what you are doing. I have had the opposite end of it where roasters are super happy to help and fix any perceived problems

On the flipside some customers can have no idea how to actually brew coffee and still complain about it, like buying pre-ground espresso coffee and then complaining it runs too fast or too slow in their machine

Coffee Roaster. Home: Sage Dual Boiler, Niche Zero, Ode v2 (SSP), 1zpresso ZP6 Work: Eagle One Prima EXP, mahlkonig e80s, Mazzer Philos and lots more

      MWJB

      You make a good point…

      I use James Hoffman’s 2 cup recipe. And usually aim around 3min 30. So this one was a full minute quicker than my usual baseline, so I guess it would be to see if the flavour would improve if I prolonged the brew?

          Tal I wouldn’t put too much store in brew time, different coffees brew at different speeds for equivalent extractions, especially if you have a large amount of liquid above the bed at the time you stop pouring, as this increases brew time variance.

          In Hoffmann’s Hario white filter test, 2 of the Japanese white 02 papers he tried, completed at 2:20 & 2:35 respectively.

          Focus on grind size, keeping to pour times & resulting taste balance.

          • Tal likes this.

            Tal Received the Udesa myself today, it was roasted on the 28th, so it’s 4 days rested already, so thought I’d give it a go in a v60

            Looking forward to it. Let’s see how they fare as espresso!

              On travel to Japan, I picked up quite a lot from Kurasu and a bag from LILO. They were all fantastic, delivering the stated notes in the recommended brew methods and recipes. The only stuff I’ve had that consistently does that closer to home is from The Picky Chemist, but those are premium micro lots roasted exceptionallly and so command luxury prices.

              I suppose one thing I would be up for is sharing larger import orders and then shipping on from there. But, for now, I’ve started a Tim Wendleboe subscription, which I will check out - if it disappoints, I move to one from Kurasu or LILO.


              My last Skylark offering, was this

              https://skylark.coffee/collections/coffee/products/china-banka-natural

              I have never had a coffee from China before. Through both the imitation V60 and the Moccamaster it was tasteless brown water, so for breakfast I made an americano. I mistakenly extracted 44 gms from 18 where 36 would be my normal……it seems that there is a pattern with coffee I make mistakes on! The end result was tasty. I can get cherry or dark fruits but no chocolate but I will tweak it at 11am or so. I believe in giving credit where it is due

              https://www.suddencardiacarrestuk.org/2024/02/thank-goodness-for-madeira-cake/

              InfamousTuba The process for the extract decaf is still sugarcane process, they have just labelled it as water and ethyl acetate but they are the same process by different names. The process isn’t labelled as sugarcane because the ethyl acetate isn’t derived from 100% sugar cane but from fruit as well

              Thanks for this, I had no idea.

                whinmoor85 I wrote to 3 Marks and asked them for their preferred recipe. Here’s what I got back:

                Our recipe for that coffees is:

                • 20g coffee (a little bit finer, medium fine.)
                • 320g water at 90 degrees.
                • 60gr water in 30sec. blooming.
                • 4 pouring of 65gr.

                  Jcheney As stated many times, taste is subjective. I bought a kilo of Extrawelt last yr on recommendation and really didn’t like it. 🤣😩
                  I’ve been burnt a couple of times buying from Django now so that’s a roaster off the list.

                  Each to their own, I just don’t think it’s for me.
                  It was actually the last kilo purchase I’ve made, just too much of a gamble now so I’ve got a few subscriptions on the go and I’m enjoying the sampling a few.

                      ST30B Yeah. Making/taking recommendations is always a risk… As this thread was more about bean’s being interesting/impressive, all I can say is that that was one of the few that I felt was undoubtedly interesting. Did your batch meet that criteria (regardless of whether it was your taste profile)?

                      MediumRoastSteam and I will both be getting the same batch of beans given the proximity in order date. I’ll report back if the beans are no longer as interesting/impressive. But the batch that I got back on 09-Nov was a fun weird impressive taste.

                      The beans also had the interesting property of having an unusual grind feel by hand. I could feel that some grind rotations were relatively easy (like a medium roast) and others were very difficult (like a light roast). Officially they describe Extrawelt as “omniroast”, and I wondered if their use of omniroast meant that they were blending roast profiles (probably not…).

                          Jcheney - thanks. In all honesty I never really something I disliked from Django - so they are a safe roaster, for me at least. But I equally never really anything that impressed me that much. Worse case scenario I’ll happily drink the coffee. Best case I’ll enjoy so much that I’ll order more! 👍

                            I picked up most of the available offerings in the new drop from The Picky Chemist. Needless to say, I’ll be pausing my Tim Wendleboe sub when these arrive, heh.

                            These are an indulgence, so probably not what most would want to resort to.

                            From this side of the pond, I’m enjoying small 36g batches from Taith, and some of the coffees from Sweven (have Cata project, El Divisio, and Los Rodriguez).

                              6 days later

                              Reviving this thread as I’ve been experiencing the enormous disparity of quality from UK roasters.

                              I’ve been traveling a bit recently and didn’t have the chance to roast/rest coffee in time so bought a few bags of single origin.

                              Two of them, one Welsh roaster and one Birmingham based one, were incredibly disappointing. Zero of the documented tasting notes present and overall just a mediocre taste vaguely resembling supermarket coffee. If someone had told me it was actually relabelled supermarket beans I’d not have been surprised. One of them I also tasted from about a week off-roast through to about 2 weeks and it didn’t improve.

                              Then I picked up a bag while away from Origin, an El Salvador called Santa Elena. Using the exact same brewing parameters (Kalita Wave and Aergrind) it was absolutely night and day. Full of flavour and bang on the tasting notes of strawberry/apricot.

                              I honestly think some roasters just don’t really know what they’re doing.

                              La Marzocco Linea Mini - Mazzer Philos

                              Ikawa Roaster

                                HarveyMushman I honestly think some roasters just don’t really know what they’re doing.

                                I wonder how many roasters have been “fast tracked” instead of good old fashioned time spent learning from the ground up and honing roasting skills from hard earned experience. I would be interested to know if all of the tech and programming of roasters is contributing to this and making roasters more complacent, after all if the graphs and numbers look good! Controversial I know!

                                    It’s interesting because I’d guess (and this is a total guess) that the bigger money for small-medium sized roasters is in stocking local or nationwide cafes with a regular wholesale deal. I know one roaster that started this way. Through friends and connections they agreed to stock a handful of shops exclusively which allowed a level of security in starting the business.

                                    However, as we’ve discussed at length, 99% of consumers probably don’t even know the coffee is good or bad, and likely to be an enormous improvement on the instant granules they drink at home.

                                    Retail customers pay a higher price, but I’d still estimate that it makes up quite a small percentage of profits compared to wholesale which means the demand is actually coming from people who probably don’t know what good coffee is, rather than the other way round. Hence the perpetuality of mediocre coffee.

                                    I guess what I’m saying is that in some ways, it’s more commercially viable to be mediocre than it is to be good.

                                    Obviously there are roasters that are good either way, but I think the above might partly explain why there are so many that aren’t.

                                    La Marzocco Linea Mini - Mazzer Philos

                                    Ikawa Roaster

                                    Tasting notes are a product of cupping. That said, roasters may tweak the roast specifically for cupping and this may not necessarily transfer to the bulk roasts. I always take the cupping notes with a pinch of salt and focus mainly on the processing method and roast level. Then we come on to price and the old saying, ‘you get what you pay for’ which while not always the case when it comes to coffee purchases, I have found myself increasingly disappointed with coffee sold with hypse which doesn’t transfer to the cup. That said, I’ve paid a lot for some coffees that have also not hot the mark either. Few beans I’ve bought over the last twelve months have been stellar. However, two offerings from Darkwoods - El Placer Yellow and El Placer Purple have been exceptional.