Where’s your palate at?

JimmyP Well, people here tend to make their own coffee beverage, rather than buy it (like you might a pack of cheese & onion crisps), so you also need to consider (as well as a higher interest in gear/technique, over Oz Clarke style taste reviews) that some people’s ability to taste what they make is fine and that:

a) There may be a malfunction in the making of the drink getting in the way of its presentation.

b) They may prefer it with additions like milk, sugar.

c) The notes supplied by the roaster may be tenuous/overly specific (I’ve never eaten a lingonberry, nor tasted an orange blossom). Some people seem to see specific notes as a little pretentious (not just in coffee, I’ve seen it with respect to beer & whisky too).

For me personally, how nice the coffee is overall trumps whether supplied notes are tangible, but it’s a bonus when it all comes together (at least one or two of the notes mentioned are detectable). Non coffee nerds that I make coffee for, talk of a lack of expected ‘bitterness, wine like, fruit, nice’, etc.

Adrianmsmith Its probably better to talk about equipment!!

Isn’t the purpose of using specific equipment to steer the flavour profile?

I can only laugh at the time/money some spend in their pursuit of the hyped next best thing. Once a decent level of equipment is reached you’re just pissing in the wind trying to get much more than .5% perceived improvement. By far the most important variable is the coffee being used. I have a very capable machine/grinder setup that gives me exactly what I prefer with straight espresso, main focus is on green selection/roast development. That will deliver by far more results in the demitasse than all equipment changes made regardless of price spent.

Also don’t buy into the ‘supertaster’ bull**** as we all have different levels of taste/aroma perception. None is better than the rest, just different. Hilarious when some mention they aren’t on a ‘professional/expert’ level when discussing their findings on coffee, equipment, etc. Only difference between professional and amateur status is the pro gets paid to do it, definitely means nothing in the way of actual skill/knowledge on a given subject.

MWJB

I would argue it’s about getting “better” coffee based on whichever metric you may wish to use to measure that!

There’s also the functional side of how things work, do they make your life easier or more repeatable. Workflow, ease of use etc not to mention sometimes just wanting something pretty or well made. We might try to tell ourselves that we’re chasing marginal gains but I think a lot of us enjoy the hobby and like to experiment with no specific purpose or expected outcomes.

JimmyP Surely if we’re looking to enjoy the finer points of coffee tasting then milk will cloud the issue? 🤔

Why do you think that? There are espresso based drinks and espresso drinks. Each are individual. Obviously if you pick up certain flavours in straight espresso then it is highly unlikely you will detect the same flavours in milk….but that does not somehow make your preference for non milk based drinks any more relevant.

Of course you are right that a person gets to a certain level of kit, then the returns are diminished and it becomes a billy big balls excercise

JimmyP

Unfortunately, for those who do not agree, espresso based milk drinks are enjoyable.

Straight espresso is , putting it politely, not enjoyable .

Maybe i should leave the forums and stick with facebook if the forums need everyone to actually enjoy straight espresso. ☕

Adrianmsmith Both are enjoyable to those that enjoy them. I have, in the past, very much enjoyed coffee with milk. Sadly, this option was taken from me, rather than a conscious decision, or choice. So now, mainly black coffee for me unless a non-dairy option is available (I don’t stock milk at home).

Nevertheless, coffee with/without milk has a taste…surely this can be discussed?

I’ve never heard anyone say coffee with milk is not enoyable. I have heard people express a preference/requirement for coffee without. It’s not necessarily a slur on adding milk. Besides, you make coffee with water, at this point extraction has happened…from now on the addition of milk is an adjustment/dilution of the coffee made.

JimmyP More defensive stuff. I reckon some people here need a cupping session with a good teacher! 😅👍

No one needs a cupping session.

JimmyP But I also believe that straight espresso can be delicious to anyone. Assuming it’s prepared correctly

I always prepare it correctly and deliciously, by adding it to milk ☕