I’ve had my machine a couple of months now and have been using Tesco bottled water but yesterday emptied it out and made the switch to water from the Zero, as someone who really doesn’t pick up all the flavours in coffee even to me this mornings coffee didn’t taste right, not very enjoyable with something missing.

I’m conversant with mm cm m etc and even gms and kilos but would 100mgs be 0.1 gm?

    SurreyAlan I’m conversant with mm cm m etc and even gms and kilos but would 100mgs be 0.1 gm

    You’ve got it spot on. 👍😊

      I remineralise zero water with 64mg of sodium bicarbonate / litre of Zero Water.

      I make up 5 litre batches at a time in an old Tesco Asbeck bottle. 320mg sodium bicarbonate to 5 litres. Works well as an easy recipe and tastes good

      Rob1 it’s a profitec 400 so single boiler hx, the boiler is only 1.6l. The tesco ashbeck has been watered down with zero already but yesterday I took a lot of hot water out of the boiler along with lots of back flushing and just running it through the head so while there’s bound to be some tesco still there it must be very diluted. Will see how it tastes tomorrow.

          SurreyAlan along with lots of back flushing and just running it through the head so while there’s bound to be some tesco still there it must be very diluted.

          Backflushing will do nothing. The water gets pumped, hits the expansion valve and goes back to the tank :-) - If you want to recycle the brew boiler, then just draw water from the group. 👍

            If it’s a HX there’s no need to empty the boiler. If you’ve got 100mg/l Sodium bicarb then you’ve increased the alkalinity significantly over ashbeck.

            CoyoteOldMan If you use potassium, then instead of 67 - 100 mg/l you need to use 80 - 120 mg/l to get 40 - 60 KH

            I have ordered some scales and potassium bicarbonate. I am going to use zero water for the time being and then remineralise it with KHCO3.~

            Could I please check the two formulas. the one above is :

            80-120mgl = 0.08 - 0.12 grammes per litre of zero water

            There is also a bulk formula you mentioned in the past where you add 20ml of it to I think 5 litres? Could you just remind me what that is please of potassium bicarbonate?

            Also does it matter that much whether you put 80mgl or 120 mgl or anything in between. I was going to use 100mgl per litre of zero water to keep it simple and easy to remember

                MediumRoastSteam going to do the same

                Whats the bulk concentrated KHC03 formula where you use 20ml at a time please?

                  coffeealex Yep. All correct. 80 mg/l KHCO3 will get you 40 KH and 120 mg/l will get you 60 KH. 100 mg/l is 50 KH. All are fine.

                  “my” concentrate is 1.60 grams of KHCO3 in 400 ml water, then use 20 g (or ml) of this per litre of water to get 40 KH. The 400 ml is because I had a jar with a screw top that would hold that much, so scale it for whatever you are going to use - don’t make too much of it, or you’ll need months to use it (and probably end up throwing some away).

                  If you want to stick to 100 mg/l (50 KH), then use 2.00 grams in 400 ml of water, then use 20 g (ml) of concentrate per litre.

                      CoyoteOldMan Thank you for this. I know that you have to periodically flush the service boiler to prevent a build up of minerals. What would happen if you never flushed it? Would it increase the scalability?

                          coffeealex If the only thing you are adding to the water is bicarbonate, scale will never be an issue. However, at some point, corrosion may be… as bicarbonate turns to much more alkaline carbonate. And at some other point the (bi)carbonate will saturate the water and start precipitating, which can cause all sorts of problems from clogging to disgusting-tasting coffee.

                            Thanks. This is the bit that always confuses me : I understand the scaling bit but still not fully understanding the corrosion part. I thought water was more corrosive the more acidic it became? Is there then also a point at which it is more corrosive when alkaline levels increase by quite s bit due to the accumulation of those in the boiler? Sorry for coming across a bit ignorant in all this.

                              coffeealex Alkaline substances can be highly corrosive. “Caustic soda” (sodium hydroxide) is not called ‘caustic’ by chance.

                              Corrosion of metals by alkaline substances is usually less of a problem than by acids, but it’s not absent. 316/316L steels perform very well against alkali corrosion, but 304 steel and copper less so (copper particularly in the presence of carbonates).

                                  coffeealex Corrosion is not just driven by pH, but also by salts concentration (TDS), and which salt type(s), and the metal(s) involved, and their surface finish, and their physical layout, and, and, and… I’d rather use a rule of thumb and say that if you are using only bicarbonate, flushing water out and replacing it every couple of months is more than enough (unless you are in a commercial/high volume environment). You could probably go six months without any issues.

                                    Many thanks for the concentrate idea, discovered my scales really aren’t that accurate measuring 0.1 gm though I thought later they might do better if I had put a weight on rather than starting at 0. As the new mix works its way through be interesting to see if the taste reverts, the oddest thing is that with zero water coffee tastes dry.

                                    I have noticed that hardness in water is measures in multiple ways: ppl, mgl, french degrees, german degrees, caco3 etc. Which do most people use?