AJuar Then, I must say that I take care of Dave’s holidays inconvenience, because it is difficult to “cause the machine to fail”, however in my personal morning routine it’s very easy. I will explain this: the machine switches on automatically at 6:50 a.m., I wake up at 7:20 a.m. and I make coffee at 7:30 a.m. When I arrive in front of the machine, the steam boiler is normally at eco mode (12 minutes for eco mode because the machine reaches the temperature in less than 10 minutes), then I make coffee, while the steam boiler rises to 130 degrees Celsius. If I wait a little more time, or if I touch the screen, the steam boiler warm up, and if it rises 130º (approximately) IN THIS CASE THE MACHINE FAIL

Try this test run the machine and steam boiler in a way that there would be a failure e.g. reaches 130C. But just before you pull the shot, switch the steam boiler off…..what happens?

  • The idea of this is to eliminate temperature of the steam boiler to be the cause….or the fact that’s it an electrical issue due to the the steam boiler being heated.
  • The other test is to change the boiler priority, then enter a potential fail condition with a reversed boiler priority

The above would be 2 separate tests!

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      AJuar My solution for this is switching off the steam boiler before coffee extraction, making the coffee, and then, switching on the steam boiler (with tactile screen it’s very easy and the boiler reaches the temperature quickly) and then I steam the milk. Also, If I make the coffee quickly with eco mode, not problem. I was happy with this, it was not a problem for me, and the Vesuvius coffee is really great, I had assumed this little inconvenience. If I insist with this is only out of pure curiosity, and also to collaborate with my friend @kautivo. When he said to me that Dave and Paolo would look at his machine, I was happy because I thought that you really would find the CAUSE of the problem (it is more important for me than the solution or any partial solution like adapting the pid configuration). Well, in fact it’s not really important for me, I have also spent time with this and I was also determined not to spend more time and effort. I had adapted my morning routine.

      Yes, that is what I’m doing for years. Not switching the boiler off but playing with the eco mode to keep temperature under 120º. I have adapted my routine, yes, it works ok this way but… it’s annoying.

        DavecUK Like yesterday, in the afternoon the Vesuvius didn’t fail at all. This is another information that could be important? It only fails in the morning, when the machine is cold, after all night switched off, and it warms from less temperature. Perhaps a valve? I really don’t know, I have no idea.

        Thank you very much, tomorrow morning I will do the two suggested tests.



          Tap required to clean out these threads. what size?

          DavecUK

          finally today i have time to look at the V

          as you said, pain in the A to get access but my steam valve is behind the electrics no the boilers so 1% easier!!!

          As suspected no thread locker on the valve on the rear side. BUT it did have from the factory, Previous owner “hasn’t worked on it” Well, someone clearly has! threads totally dry and easily removed by hand.

          Dave do you know the correct tap size please to clean out the old thread locker on the back side of the valve.

          Also what semi permanent thread locker would you use to re-assemble?

          Ade Smith. ACS Evo Leva v2. Kafatek Flat max 2, ssw 2024. Mazzer Philos, Craig Lyn HG-1 prime., WW key mk1.

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              Adrianmsmith Dave do you know the correct tap size please to clean out the old thread locker on the back side of the valve.

              Also what semi permanent thread locker would you use to re-assemble?

              I would simply use a very small jewellers type screwdriver to un down the thread, you don’t need a tap and only need to get the loose stuff out.

              Loxeal 18:10 is a good semipermanent thread locker, you will only need one or two drops…personally though I would try PTFE tape first as it’s much much cheaper and should work fine.

              I took this wand apart completely and assembled it with Loxeal 18:10 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/314135700947?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338723872&toolid=20006&customid=ll0fvV4aAAAAiyt0J_JRzj-leU4wAAAAAA

              You can also use Loctite 542

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                  DavecUK I have made the two tests, and in both cases the machine tends to fail in a potential failure condition (not always). Also, in one case out of 20 approximately, with the boiler priority, the machine has showed very different pressure behaviour even with the steam boiler off, from cold. I have the video of this but I’m not going to upload because I know that you trust me. This should be an evidence of a capricious mechanical little valve stuck? I don’t know.

                  To sum up, the machine:

                  -          WITH THE SAME PID CONFIGURATION THE MACHINE MAKES DIFFERENT EXTRACTIONS.

                  -          The machine shows an astonishing regular behaviour with the STEAM BOILER OFF. She makes GREAT COFFEE, or very predictable or regular extractions.

                  -          There is some relationship between the pressure of the STEAM BOILER, because the machine fails an high percentage of times with the STEAM BOILER ON, or with high temperature in any part of the internal machine.

                   

                  I know that this failure is difficult to solve, but I hope that ACS technicians have the time and the capacity to investigate with the @kautivo Vesuvius machine to try to identify the CAUSE of this capricious failure in order to solve it.  If not, I assume that ACS Vesuvius works like this and I’ll continue to make the coffee with my little annoying morning routine (switching off and on the steam boiler in the morning).

                  Thanks!

                      AJuar Sorry to not following the history of entire discussion… anyway my question if this behavior is happening regardless if steam boiler in in ECO-mode or not?

                          Spid3r00 my friend in Eco mode the steam boiler is with low temperature then there isn’t fail…

                            what dose it do at different stem boiler temps? 120 -125 -130 etc,

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                              Cuprajake the dosis is the same, 17g or 18g the fail happens when the steam boiler is over 120°…

                                but under 120 fine?

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                                  Cuprajake yes but there are a big difference when you froth the milk…it’s better over 125° we have checked i hope they find where is the problem.

                                    i personally have all my machines at 125,

                                    have you tried 123 and a two hole tip,

                                    its a very weird fault

                                    Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                                      Cuprajake but the machine must work right independient of the temperature steam boiler…have you check your machine with 128° ?

                                        i have a bianca

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                                          AJuar DavecUK I have made the two tests, and in both cases the machine tends to fail in a potential failure condition (not always). Also, in one case out of 20 approximately, with the boiler priority, the machine has showed very different pressure behaviour even with the steam boiler off, from cold. I have the video of this but I’m not going to upload because I know that you trust me. This should be an evidence of a capricious mechanical little valve stuck? I don’t know.

                                          You have ruled out software as the issue then because if it was a software bug it would fail every time.

                                          I cannot understand how a valve or plumbing would have this effect. You tried with HX off and on which includes or eliminates the 2 halves of the brew circuit, and noticed the same behaviour. This means those sections of the brew circuit cannot be at fault?

                                          Logically this leads to the fault being outside the sealed brew circuit (or at either end of it)…but it doesn’t make sense on how this could have the effects you are observing?

                                          • If it’s the pump end, there is always "push from the pump and I can’t see how an intermittently leaky 1 way valve would have this effect
                                          • A leaky autofill valve would drop the pressure but you would see the service boiler overfilling over time (you should check this). Even so, I don’t see how a leak could cause a pressure peak, unless it’s chattering (leaking on/off/on/off), possibly that might affect the PIDs ability to control the pump. Even so if it was leaking why only when the steam boiler is on…perhaps it’s warming up and then the defect is showing? It might be the reason why the fault doesn’t present itself until the service boiler has been on a while?

                                          So check whether the boiler is overfilling and if it is it might be the autofill valve…?

                                          My confusion about the autofill valve is 4 machines, all done it from new, all with faulty autofill valves that cause PID issues in a particular way when the service boiler is on…..doesn’t sound very probable does it. Especially as I am only guessing on something having this effect.

                                          If I’m honest I don’t know, it doesn’t make sense and I couldn’t reproduce it, which means I couldn’t find the cause?

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                                              DavecUK i have to give thanks again your effort to try help us and to resolve the problem in our Vesuvius! I hope before or after we know where is the problem.

                                              Thanks a lot!

                                                DavecUK Thanks! It sounds viable. This morning I have purged the water of the steam wand and the first time 17-18 g of water come out before the steam. Is this normal? Is there another way to check the service boiler level? Where is the autofill valve placed? Could I buy another valve and replace it or it’s an electrical problem? Please, send me the diagram of the Vesuvius or the code of the autofill valve, in order to buy another if it is necessary. Also, the chattering that you mention is an electrical issue, then I’m really not capable of checking electrical issues.

                                                Please let me know. Is it possible to check these things in the factory with the @kautivo coffee machine?

                                                Thank you very much