Or it’s just Lance being Lance, recently he’s ripped everything apart from the zerno grinder.
Pushed that as hard as the time more and the pre sale sold out in just 5mins 250 grinders. There already on the V2 version of the grinder whilst not fully having sent out the version 1 from march payments.
I’ve never know such fomo around coffee gear ATM,
Re the decent, I’m not sure it’s a machine that you would use for making 15 shots back to back. I look at it more as an experimental machine, while I’ve heard it be called a jack of all trades from previous owners stating their next machine was better, but that’s generally true with most who say what they have is the best so
Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -
Cuprajake I think the day of the influencer is starting to wane. Strip it away, and you have a QVC salesman appearing on camera, trying ever so hard to make you buy the latest thing. I remember when Hedrick first started out and did not have much of a following. He promoted Sage products as that seemed to be the only sponsor available to him. He even had one named after him. Where are Sage now in the Hedrick portfolio?
I would question the technical ability of most influencers. They seem hell bent on persuading folks to part with their hard earned on what are often products still under development and no where near the finished article. If I know one thing only in life, I would not buy a half finished product from a QVC salesman. I just wish more people would see the bigger picture
Decent could use the small FOT DC pump, although even then they would be space constrained for the transformer required. There would be a second problem as well, I believe (could be wrong) they use 2 vibe pumps, one for the brew thermoblock and one for the steam one? If you used a single rotary, you couldn’t steam and brew at the same time…it would be problematic.
DavecUK I believe (could be wrong) they use 2 vibe pumps, one for the brew thermoblock and one for the steam one
My understanding Dave is they use two vibe pumps in order to dynamically mix hot and cold water to the specific temperature required for the profile. This allows accurate temperature profiling as the vibe pumps can pump very small increments of water if needed, and allows it to compensate for cooler coffee/ambient temp etc. They have a separate heater for brew and steam functions.
Amazing what can be done with a Decent. First it was espresso (of course), then it was the tea portailter and now a pour over basket compliments of the extraordinay duo of Scott Rao and Jonathan Gagnes. Assuming that it works well (I harbour a wee bit of doubt depite those illustrious names), the benefits of this machine just continue to get better and better. I have ordered the basket, I’ll have a play and report back.
DavecUK that’s right. A lot of people get really hung up on this issue, which I find weird! If I’m manually profiling or reviewing the graphs I don’t don’t have enough hands or brain space to steam at the same time. I’ve heard similar from Bianca users who profile regularly, there’s too much going on! In a commercial setting, this would be a big downside. The thing is you’d have two DE1s for commercial use anyway as you’d want two groups, which allows concomitant steaming and brewing.
tompoland Yes I get your point. People shouldn’t get too hung up on the idea of a rotary pump anyway. Check the Diaspora for ‘Bengle’ John has already posted pictures of the new machine.
the Bengle is not a new machine, it was a new design concept that’s since been dropped (around two years ago from memory, which is rarely a good idea in my case) . A possible aesthetic upgrade if you will.
That’s the last I heard of it but someone may have news of its pending resurrection?
tompoland I said I’d provide an update on Lance’s variable pour times with his Decent.
Reading more craefully through the relevant thread in Diaspora, I think my theory about Lance’s discrepancies with pour times being attributed to running a 110v machine in Europe with a voltage converter is at best without foundation.
I’ve run out of ideas for explaining his experience but I note there was not even one “me too” post in the thread which surprised me a bit given that as @JammyDodger mentioned, thoroughness of puck prep is a significant variable on its own.
tompoland answering my own question and thanks @Redla for bringing me up to date.
As best I can tell it looks like mostly the same internals but a very different exterior (white metal and timber) and featuring an integrated scale, a cup warmer, 2 minute warm up time (not for the 110v version), lighting for the espresso cup area and a Samsung A7 tablet. All welcome improvements but nothing earth shattering enough to motivate me to upgrade.
dfk41 The whole influencer thing is a joke to begin with. Honestly who cares what others find works for them when every setup will vary in a different environment, various coffees being used, etc… If the social media garbage didn’t pay out in some way most of the videos would never exist as that’s the primary reason for it regardless of what some wanna claim.
One in particular was a product pimp for Breville, which is junk… as well as Baratza at one point, more junk… as well as Onxy Coffee which is over priced/hyped crap.
tompoland Extraordinary duo, bwahaha… Seems Gagne might be trying to incorporate a bit much on the scientific end and IMBHO coffee (especially espresso) is the same as roasting in that it’s ⅓ skill, ⅓ art form and ⅓ science. Maybe he should stick with boring astrophysics as coffee is far more involved!
Regarding Rao, never been impressed with his style of roasting or arrogance… to each their own obviously as I’ll never get caught up following the typical (usually short lived) fad.
Regarding the Decent as the thread suggests, maybe one day they will actually get the thing maxed out and performing to the claimed/expected standards. Never used one and have no intention, but what I’ve read from plenty of users is it’s more of a jack of all trades, but clearly master of none.
Yes I find this the best of all ways to form a reasoned opinion.
Joking aside, surely we are better on this forum than just regurgitating whatever third-hand information has slopped into our echo chamber? Let’s keep on topic.
Something has been happening recently on another forum, and similar has happened in the past from the same manufacturer. Where a customer has not only been treated shabbily, but the manufacturer has gone out of their way to blame the customer. This prompted me to say…the Decent sales experience seems a good one, John works very hard to ensure customer satisfaction.
Yeah I don’t mind john as a manufacturer, very open and honest, always looking to improve and the decent vids are some of the best manufacturer vids out there, lelit insider is another good channel
I find it odd more manufacturer dont do it.
Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -
tompoland Real time manual adjustment of pressure or flow by tapping the group head. A bit of a party trick, not sure I’d ever use it.
I use it quite a lot when initially dialling in a new bean Tom. I don’t always know the grind size required on the Niche to get a tasty shot with the correct flow rate on the first go. With the manual flow control I can get it pretty much dialled in by watching the flow rate, and will adjust the profile or grind setting afterwards to fine tune it.
Generally though I agree, the DE1 is automated enough that once a bean is dialled, you get exactly what you’ve requested every time.
Just watched this - interesting for me in that its the first time I have seen the machine unpacked and setup.
Have to say very impressed - liked the case and how it was packed. Also like the ceramics used for the drip tray and tank. Also liked the clear see through look - I would think it woudl be useful to keep an eye on the system without dismantling.
Had the DE1XL for three years now. Lots of other espresso machines have come and gone around it. It can be as simple or as complex as you want to make it. They are a very well thought out machine.
Access to presets/recipes from an active community of espresso obsessed nerds to sample on demand at the push of a button is pretty cool.
There is no “best” machine out there, but the Decent is certainly my favourite.
At this time the likely replacement for my Sage Dual Boiler is a Decent.
My only concerns are longevity. I’m pretty sure a Bianca for example will be serviceable for 10 years plus but will Decent be around then? Probably and if not I believe a lot of components are off the shelf.
A couple of questions I had for existing users is:
Can you enter coffee bean data on the tablet ie the roaster, orgin, roast date etc? If so I presume you can analyse this data fairly easily?
Does the portafilter heat up in the group or does it require a few flushes?
Chriss29 My only concerns are longevity. I’m pretty sure a Bianca for example will be serviceable for 10 years plus but will Decent be around then? Probably and if not I believe a lot of components are off the shelf.
So far, so good. Five years in the wild and very few issues reported. John Buckman has been pretty fussy about component quality.
Chriss29 A couple of questions I had for existing users is:
Can you enter coffee bean data on the tablet ie the roaster, orgin, roast date etc? If so I presume you can analyse this data fairly easily?
Does the portafilter heat up in the group or does it require a few flushes?
Don’t think you can enter data. There may be a “skin” (display interface) for that but I’ve only used the stock skin. Alternate skins abound.
Yes the portafilter heats up in the group and the metal temperature is displayed on the tablet.
Wow the temperature of the metal, that’s impressive!
I think it’s a good thing the software is an open system however I think I’d only ever like to use the Decent software, as I’d presume that’s the most reliable even if not the most functional.
I’m a little surprised it doesn’t have a ‘beanconqueror’ style function, perhaps they are happy for users to use 3rd party apps such as the aforementioned.
I use despresso app on the iPad. That allows you to enter roaster name/bean/origin etc to build a data set. It also automatically uploads your shot to the visualiser website - this can be shared with other users to fine-tune your shots.
Chriss29 Can you enter coffee bean data on the tablet ie the roaster, orgin, roast date etc? If so I presume you can analyse this data fairly easily?
Just to answer this point, yes you can enter all data into the tablet including roaster, origin, roast date, how much you liked it etc through an extension called ‘Describe Your Espresso’. It makes it really easy to keep track of which beans/origins etc you like best, and which grind setting you used to really make them sing.
Having declared that the Decent displays the temperature of the ‘metal’, I thought I better check exactly what ‘metal’ means. I’ve posted a note to John Buckman to find out and I’ll let you know his response.
In the meantime, I took a temperature reading of the bottom of the basket once the temperature of the metal had hit it’s goal of 93c as displayed on the tablet.
The temperature on the bottom of the basked was a measly 27c at that point.
One flush and it was up to 41c and with a second flush it was up to a more acceptable 65c.
Note that this was after turning the Decent on first thing in the morning and the portafilter basket would likely have gotten up to temperature, given enough time. But I don’t want to wait for potentially 20 minutes for that to happen so the bottom line is that there is a great deal of benefit in flushing the group head to bring the basket (if not the group head) up to a more acceptable temperature. Pushing 93c water though a basket that’s 27c is going to dramaticlly drop the brew temperature well below where I want it to be and the result will be an under extracted, thinner and probably a slightly sour espresso..
In the process of this checking all of this (thanks @Chriss29 for triggering this exploration) I was reminded of the fact that the Decent displays a reading of the water temperate as it hits the puck in real time. View the video below and you’ll see that the temperature reading for ‘metal’ changes to a temperature reading for ‘coffee’ once the pour starts.
Note that I have not tested the accuracy of the water temperature but I seem to recall that John Buckman and others have confirmed with a Scace device that the readings are accurate. Being able to see the actual temperature of the water as it hits the puck, in real time, is a feature I really like.
I’m wondering if there are other machines out there that do something similar. My guess is that someone else must have built this feature into their espresso machine, given the shift towards computer chips in machines and apps that measure and display what’s happing in real time. Does anyone know of other machines that have this feature?
Thanks @tompoland, this is really interesting. I would say flushing water through the group to heat the portafilter is a downside for me as it adds up to a fair amount of wastage over time and it’s not something I need to do on the SDB.
I note on your video that in the first few seconds of the shot, the coffee temp ramps from 79d to 90d, could this be owing to the cold portafilter or was it already pre heated? Either way I suppose it shows the coffee temp is only low for the first few seconds of the extraction so maybe a hot portafilter in the Decent makes little difference?
Just another question I had, is the ‘Volume’ showing the amount of water flowing to the puck, which I think goes to 87ml or is that the output? Thanks again!
Loading...
Something went wrong while trying to load the full version of this site. Try hard-refreshing this page to fix the error.
