This post from the Decent Diaspora offsets my concerns re the temperate issues. Tx to Ira

There were 5 or 6 working machines at the SCA show. They seemed more than capable of being taken home and making fine espresso as is. They sure looked finished. And yet here we are on a Decent board using a machine that’s about as far from finished as the Meticulous seemed and it’s been shipping for how many years? Looking at the machine and watching it work over maybe 10 shots, a small sample, but enough to get a feel for how it works and what some of it’s issues are, Emily was demoing and more than willing to mention everything she considered unfinished. If I was looking for a machine to pull espresso, I think it’s quite likely to end up being one of the finest. It should be as temperature stable as anything and it’s ability to do programmed pressure and flow profiling is currently matched only by the Duval. It can within it’s volume limits and flat temperature profile do anything the Decent can do and exceed it in how slow it can flow and how fast it can flow. It’s also almost silent which many would consider a huge advantage. But it’s a single shot at a time machine, possibly a big disadvantage.

    This is a one off comment fro me, and I will not reply further. There seems to be a widespread assumption, that I slandered LH. If I did, can someone show me where the term ‘liar’ came from please? It is true I do not like ‘influencers’. It is true I do like fact based reviews and can stand a little opinion in there. My spat with LH was simple. Off forum I questioned why he did not show the power brick on his grinder review as for a lot of people it would be a no no due to size/space issues. I received a flippant reply stating that his editor must have removed it from the final cut. I did not reply to that comment even though I did not believe it.

    In any case, I already had an answer he gave to Dave, who had stated that he had done 3 video reviews of the same grinder, and in each review thought it important to let the viewer see the brick and make up his own mind. LH replied along the lines of, ‘Yeah, I decided not to show it in my video’

    https://www.suddencardiacarrestuk.org/2024/02/thank-goodness-for-madeira-cake/

    Dragging up old stuff is pointless,

    Move on,

    People will never see eye to eye

    Just ignore

    Let’s talk about other things.

    Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

      DavecUK

      It would definitely appear so Dave.

      The international On-line Coffee Wannkers Society is probably a lot smaller than it seems from forums.
      There are probably 50 of us actively contributing, another 100 occasional voices and a couple of thousand lurkers.
      The folks with real coffee knowledge rarely, if ever, contribute on line and I certainly make no claims to being one of them.

      It saddens me to see such a helpful forum as this dragged through the gutters.
      I am not without fault when it comes to online comments but I do try to hold back most of the time.

        I must have missed the LH drama! Anyone have an impartial recollection of events? Seems weird that LH (or anyone in the public limelight) would blast a little forum like that 🙁

          I’ll email you

          Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

            tompoland Equal penalty for an equal violation of rules.

            Which I assume includes not slandering other members.

            Indeed, I brought it up to equate two incidents in the hope it could be de-escalated similarly, not to get back in to the original drama or take sides. I even emphasised it several times but some of the replies seem to have ignored this and got excited.

            At the end of the day I value the range of opinions here but some topics just go around in complete circles with no appreciation for nuance.

            tompoland Emily was demoing and more than willing to mention everything she considered unfinished

            I’ve seen this mentioned from other testers too, including espressofun who said Carlos encouraged him to openly discuss the issues and bugs on his channel. Understand a machine still ironing out issues after it’s asked for funding is not for everyone but the company doesn’t seem to be hiding it’s flaws at least.

                  Sham let me know if you get the email

                  Decent De1pro v1.45 - Niche Duo - Niche Zero - Decent is the best machine ever made -

                  • Sham replied to this.

                      DavecUK Nor me, I just assumed that as it’s a decent guess.

                      A 58mm basket is 26.42cm2. PxA=F , so 7.57 bars multiplied by 26.42 = 1999.994 Newtons or almost 204kg. You’d need 2377+ Newtons for 9 bar @ 55mm. How are you calculating? Perhaps I’ve gone wrong somewhere.

                        This actually brings up another point from LH’s beautiful advertisement simping video. He mentions you can ‘measure a spring’ on a londinium or other lever machine, but pressure is a function of stuff like distance. You wouldn’t be able to say ‘i put 20lb pressure on my londinium over a metre travel, therefore this almost direct piston needs 20lb of pressure.’

                        2000 netwton per sq m= 0.2 bar.

                        200 bar per sq cm…….Portafilter is about 23 cm2

                        So actually 200/23 = 8.69 bar. So yes, I miscalculated.

                        Contact me

                          FadedFrontiers Indeed, I brought it up to equate two incidents in the hope it could be de-escalated similarly, not to get back in to the original drama or take sides. I even emphasised it several times but some of the replies seem to have ignored this and got excited.

                          If you look back at the 2 incidents, Denis comment about me were in no way the same as the other incident….they were 2nd hand comments fed to him and quite abhorrent ,and untrue for anyone who cares to go back and check the posts properly.. No way will I put up with things like that. Even suggesting I had a fight with LH, his words below…I absolutely didn’t, I was in bloody Italy when it all blew up and away from the forum for a lot of the time. I won’t put up with that sort of stuff from anyone.

                          I know you had a “fight” with him for something

                          Contact me

                              DavecUK It only applies pressure to the top of the basket where there is contact though (at 58mm diameter)?

                              Regardless, if you look at LH’s video with his pressure graph, it’s showing a consistent 9 Bars which wouldn’t seem possible for that setup. Apparently this thing is supposed to be able to do 13-14 bars or something by way of a piston.

                                  capuchin I guess it needs someone to put a pressure measuring portafilter on it. I assume that must have been done during testing, that’s just basic good practice?

                                  Contact me

                                    DavecUK my point was that they both broke forum rules:

                                    Abuse, personal attacks, flaming, inciting argument, will not be tolerated.

                                    The two points you made above which separate it from the previous incident make no difference RE what I can see of the rules, but I understand why it was offensive and incorrect - I’m not denying that. Anyway I hoped it could be amicably resolved but it’s not going to be and that’s fine, happy to move on.